By Laurie Goodstein
The New York Times
MAPLEWOOD, Minn. — Like most pastors who lead thriving evangelical megachurches, the Rev. Gregory A. Boyd was asked frequently to give his blessing — and the church’s — to conservative political candidates and causes.
The requests came from church members and visitors alike: Would he please announce a rally against gay marriage during services? Would he introduce a politician from the pulpit? Could members set up a table in the lobby promoting their anti-abortion work? Would the church distribute “voters’ guides” that all but endorsed Republican candidates? And with the country at war, please couldn’t the church hang an American flag in the sanctuary?
After refusing each time, Mr. Boyd finally became fed up, he said. Before the last presidential election, he preached six sermons called "The Cross and the Sword" in which he said the church should steer clear of politics, give up moralizing on sexual issues, stop claiming the United States as a “Christian nation” and stop glorifying American military campaigns.
"When the church wins the culture wars, it inevitably loses," Mr. Boyd preached. "When it conquers the world, it becomes the world. When you put your trust in the sword, you lose the cross."Other excerpts:
"More and more people are saying this has gone too far — the dominance of the evangelical identity by the religious right," Mr. McLaren said. "You cannot say the word 'Jesus' in 2006 without having an awful lot of baggage going along with it. You can’t say the word 'Christian,' and you certainly can’t say the word 'evangelical' without it now raising connotations and a certain cringe factor in people."...
"America wasn’t founded as a theocracy," he said. "America was founded by people trying to escape theocracies. Never in history have we had a Christian theocracy where it wasn’t bloody and barbaric. That’s why our Constitution wisely put in a separation of church and state."You can read the rest of this thought-provocative article here.
Comments, gentle parishioners? Is the entanglement of some Christian sects with right-wing politics consistent with Christian philosophy? Does this story also have implications relevant to Emerald City politics?
15 comments:
It is a crying shame that some people just don’t get the idea. This is an imperfect world in which we live in. How may wars where starting in the name of God or for Jesus Christ sake. But in reality most of these conflicts are really started by none other some crooked business dealings. We as a nation are engages in a holy war in the middle east. There are times when we as a nation must be involved and for only defensive reasons only. There is a reason why the military which was ordinally was called “The Department of War”. But wisely have been changed to the name to “The Department of Defense”. The USA only mission is that of self defense.
We live in very interesting times. It is the governments role to provide for the security and tranquility of its people, we pay taxes to maintain that. The religion aspect of what we belong to, is a statement of how we are to treat other people, not only within our own faith but how we treat others of different faiths. It is not the role of religion to tell us how or who to vote for of what issues to support on the ballot. However it is their role to teach us the moral concepts to help improve ourselves, with the doctrine or principal we use learn and then use the brain that god has given us to evaluate what we understand for our experience and then let out conscience be our guide. At the ballot or how we live or lives.
However, there have come this line of thinking in recent times that goes like this, unless you have the same ideals or same mental ideas you are either stupid or have screwed up thinking process, they consider you a none conformist, a free thinker, however those are just some polite terms.
The more abrupt terms are rebellious, liberal, evil, no one of us. I am just amazed of the number of spin doctors that have their own radio talk shows spreading political propaganda. The real amazement is how many people listen to these false prophets, and how much these spin doctors receive in salaries. And how mush influence they have in the local broadcast area.
I am delighted to find there is a pastor who believes churches are for saving souls and should not be used as a propaganda machine.
Influential persons who call themselves Christians have forgotten or never knew what being a Christian means.
It certainly is not to impose your will on another when they have a different concept of Christianity.
The National Council of Churches gets my credit for influencing the current trend toward name calling and politics when you don't agree with their concepts.
The current trend by the Catholic Church and the Church of Jesus Crhist of Latter Day Saints to promote illegal aliens' entry into this country is part of a political agenda to promote the present Republican leadership position in Washington. That is not the purpose of churches.
How do the leaders of these organizations know that they are promoting the right political agenda?
What was the source of their revelation???????
Organized religion is responsible for the present chaos in the world.
Each group or sect or organization believe they have the only answer to salavation.
Why can't they live and let live and stick to saving souls??????
And quit calling me names when I disagree with what they are touting?????
The irony is that this approach is what we are supposed to be selling to the rest of the world as freedom.
lets move on to something better.
AMEN!
This topic is very timely and certainly a lot more stimulating than calling Godfrey the same old names.
Really? Both posts started out to be thoughtful...but turned into liberal bashing of the president...stupidly accusing the Catholic and LDS leadership of harboring illegals to..... what? make republians of them??
Stupid remarks. Boring thread when the discussion degenerates into 'name calling'. Especially without a scintilla of evidence.
At least with Godfrey..everything and more one can say about that control freak is true!
Godfrey, like most modern day neocons, wraps himself in a cloak of rightousness.
In the LDS venacular he believes that he has been "called" to save Ogden from itself. That is why he can be so single minded and ignore any information or ideas, from any source, that contradicts his pre-conceived notion of the problem and the fix.
Bottom line - he has the keys and every one else in Ogden doesn't. God is on his side not ours.
These kinds of disordered personalities can be very dangerous if they get in positions of power.
I think this was a great article. Unusual that not many people want to discuss it.
It is becoming increasingly common for people to use religion as a justification for a variety of actions, and many of these actions are not what one would normally think of as spiritually motivated ones. How many people have we seen on trial whose defense is that God told them to do whatever heinous thing it is that they have done?
A court of law can neither prove nor disprove whether or not God spoke to someone, but it can enforce the laws of the land. And herein lies the problem of religion entering into politics. Many people view their religious beliefs as being somehow of a higher order than laws made by human beings. And when these beliefs become acceptable as a justification for harmful actions, especially on a national scale, all existing human laws, contracts, and agreements take second place and our established system of justice becomes worthless. When that happens, chaos ensues. And many times, war.
Using a religious justification for harmful acts against people is very close to the Machiavellian idea that the end justifies the means, which, if one looks at it closely, is absolutely contrary to the basic teachings of almost all religions. And I think this is what the pastor is saying when he refers to the choice between the Cross and the Sword-- that one cannot honestly be living one's religion when engaging in activities against its basic tenets, no matter what the end result might be.
There is only one common dominator in all of these Webb bloggs. That either you are for Mayor Godfrey or you are not, if you are not it is because you have seen or heard things that have gone on and therefore you know that here is a common thread of what bonds people here.
A good leader will know how to unite the people into a common goal for the community. Some leader have been successful in creating a common enemy that everyone one loves to hate.
I mean look at the cold war between the USA and the USSR. We were all united regardless of who was in power and the goals were very well laid out and defined,
Russia society was just as equally defined as well. They hated the USA because we neglected the poor and down trodden for the benefit of the few wealthy and powerful.
USA hated the USSR because their economics was of equality and they had a right to jobs but there was no real room for personal growth or development.
That was the world’s Yin and Yang. German had the same thing happen to them they had to create a evil greedy enemy. It was called the “Jews” and very one loved to hate them in that day and age.
Now in this day an age the new evil is called “Liberals”. If you are not other than main stream ultra conservative republicanism. You are looks down as the ungodly and the mentis to society. I would liken this to a swinging pendulum. The pendulum is now swung to the right. However gravity and the force of momentum, will cause the social pendulum to swing to the left. However, this type of swing is very gradual and a lot of time. It is very hard to see the effects taken place.
I do now observed that the swing is starting to go towards the self righteous of certain Christians. Because they have hidden behind God and Country and used these emblems as a shield.
By pretending to be righteous and going to church while they are taking advantage of the poor and the working class for personal gains and glory, by cutting services meanwhile they are giving themselves pay raises far above the ratio of pay of the working class with severance packages to boot as well. Then claiming that God has blessed them for their righteousness.
They have ignored the laws themselves while they have the law enforcement people who are under their control, come down on their political enemies with law books in their hands (which they themselves are constantly changing for their own personal benefits) and with the color of authority to wheel and deal.
They do not really believe in checks and balances in government because the are ever trying to eliminate elected offices that the voters once had a voice to who should hold that office but they themselves believes that the voters are to stupid to pick the right person for the job and they want that power to fill that position themselves.
Concerned Citizen,
Your argument that Godfrey and his minions consider themselves to blessed by God for being righteous is a crock.
I've never heard one statement by any of them to that effect. Only that the mayor has more integrity than anyone else!! Just ask him.
Godfrey, in my opinion, is self-righteous. He believes everything he does is good and good for Ogden. But being an egotistical bully does not mean that God is on his side.
I'd be willing to wager that Godfrey thinks he doesn't need God's approbation.
It is my opinion that Godfrey is a dangerous person because he appears to be a sociopath.
If he could get away with it, I think he would be even more punitive to those he considers his inferiors and enemies. Which seems to be just about anyone.
He is power hungry. He is an abuser. Controlling, vindictive, mean, retaliatory to the extreme.
Religion, unfortunately, plays no part in this man's decision making.
You didn't name him, but you didn't need to.
Like most bullies, he shrinks back when confronted with strength. He EXPECTS people to acquiesce....he enjoys holding one's employment in his hands.
If this Council would act as a body and amend the ordinances that will restore their rightful authority and duties, this little man will pout, sulk and throw a little fit...but, he'll have learned he can't push any of them around.
(Maybe a couple who appear to like pandering to him.)
Greiner needs to throw his girth against the demands of this little dictator.
When we elect a real mayor, a grown-up this time, let us pray that he gives the boot to Greiner and Cook, and gets a chief who stands with his officers. It is my understanding that Cook is hired by the council. But they don't seem to be getting very much loyalty and help from him.
If the council hired him....they should think of replacing him. If that's the mayor's purview (and everything seems to be), then the new mayor can CAN him!
Organized religion' isn't what is wrong with the world. Disorganization in our own lives that feeds on greed and selfishness, dishonesty in our dealings, abuse, abuse of power...those are the culprits.
If we (all) were practicing what 'organized religion' has been preaching the entire world would be a safer place for mankind.
Observations about this one.
1. Philosopher David Hume suggested that whenever someone starts talking about religion you should put your hand on your wallet to make sure it is safe.
2. Of course Ogden's mayor believes he is doing the right thing. The scary thing is, he comes from a background that says one needs to support authority without question.
3. I wonder where vindictiveness comes under the heading of "integrity." I thought revenge belonged to the god of the mayor's religion.
Several questions, too:
Who would Jesus hate?
Who would Jesus bomb?
Or is "Jesus is love" just another liberal plot?
If high priest leader Godfrey actually listened to and understood the teachings of President Hinckley he would not act anything like he does.
That of course goes for most politicians in Utah. The great mystery to me is why doesn't the church leadership make this more clear to the Utah politicians?
As some one pointed out recently, Utah politicians do not literally take directions from Temple Square, they merely act in a way that they think, filtered through their own arrogance, the church wants them to act.
mercy livermore
I read what you said about Godfrey. However, did you forget that the reason why the street feast that was held annually every summer during the weekend before the 24th celebrations started to commencements. Why is no longer the on going tradition?
They would serve beer and that is the reason why the street feast was discontinued. He does usually allow his religion to make a lot of his decisions for him.
And what about that 800 pound Gorilla, You know the Now Stake President of the Ogden Stake of the LDS church former Mayor of Ogden, to read a letter from the pulpit, for the member’s to stop criticizing Pee Wee Mayor Godfrey?
I remember that Mark Johnson, (yes Godfrey’s right hand man, the “Hummer” guy) used to coin this phrase many years ago. “That person is not a legend in his own time, he just a legend in his own mind.” Isn’t that the essence of Godfrey arrogance?
Just because he doesn’t outright vocally claim that he righteous, (however, Claiming that you have more integerty than anyone elese in this room...)isn't that a declaration that you are more righteos within itself? This doesn’t mean that his actions don’t shield any of this claim...In fact I have a friend that lives in his ward and is part of that High Priest Group. He stated to me that someone had cracked a joke and Mayor Godfrey got upset and chastised him for being light minded. During their meeting. And further more that there is not place for any type of jokes during this type of meeting.
Dear CC
Godfrey does NOT represent the church in any official capacity.
Unfortunately, in MHO, he misrepresents the church.
It's a sad fact of life that every institution (and barrel) has a bad apple.
I guess I'm light minded. I make a lot of jokes in class at church, and so do most of the others there.
However, they are 'light' humor...and I wouldn't represent them as being 'light minded'.
The man is an egotist. He has no sense of humor. He's controlling, mean, small minded, abusive, abuses power, and vindictive. There's more, but you probably get the idea?
Please don't judge the church and it's leadership by the very public antics of one clown.
Surely we don't denigrate the Pope, who is an honorable man, by the actions of some pedophile priests.
And we shouldn't call all athletes 'cheats' because some ARE!
I find Godfrey beyond embarrassing. I think he's a dangerous person.
In MHO, he's a sociopathic personality and it appears by his actions in following Officer Jones and his wife that he is also paranoid.
The first amendment provides for a "seperation of church and state." Although many say that Godfrey has never brought religion into his political realm. Can anyone argue that he hasn't brought his politics into church?
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