I've verified this afternoon that there are the nineteen citizen-aspirants for the four Ogden City Council seats that are up for grabs in November. I verified this by standing inside the city recorder's office when she slammed the front door shut this afternoon at 5:00 p.m. It's a fairly large list. Unlike last time we had a municipal election, I predict that this will be a very "energetic" city council race. Here's a list of the "horses" as they leave the gate:Ogden City Council Candidate Roster
2005 Elections
8/15/05 -- 5:00 p.m.
Municipal Ward 1
Jesse M. Garcia, 750 Healy Street, 778-6834
David Berghout, 2669 Madison Avenue, 399-3472
Dori Mosher, 719 Belnap Circle, 778-0482
Municipal Ward 3
Ronald L. Hale, 1058 Rushton, 622-2687
Stephen J. Larsen, 1467 Jefferson Avenue, 564-5000
Mitch Moyes, 1710 Capitol Street, 399-3279
Clifton Douglas Stephens, 1131 16th Street, 393-9796
At Large Seat A
Daryl S. Andersen, 2849 Eccles Avenue, 391-6515
James E. Carrell, 2634 Quincy Avenue, Apt. 1, 686-0107
Bill Glasmann 1730 28th Street 628-1799
Kent W. Jorgenson, 1364 Arlington Drive, 393-1885
Jack McWain Sr., 1659 Childs Avenue, 627-6035
Kori Munns, 2906 Taylor Avenue, 612-1234
At Large Seat B
Joshua Belka, 2622 Madison Avenue, 499-1880
Donna S. Burdett, 4421 Taylor Avenue, 394-1521
Jeff LeFevre, 934 N. Quincy Avenue, 782-5359
Steven M. Prisbrey, 625 Iowa Street, 668-8824
John H. Thompson, 1506 24th Street, 621-1808
Dorrene E. Jeske 1056 E. 425 N. 782-5827
I promise there will more information on each of these people here on Weber County Forum as November approaches.
One of the things I'll be trying to do here, by the way, is to put together a list of questions to each of these candidates. Although I've already composed a few of my own, I wonder -- do the gentle readers of Weber County Forum have any questions they'd like to ask these candidates?
Comments or candidate questions are invited, as the horses head off into the first turn.
Here's a map of the Ogden precincts, BTW... just in case you don't already know which "big government" incumbent you plan to vote against this November.
Update 9/16/05 11:13 p.m. MT: This morning's Standard-Examiner features another fine John Wright article, which provides more information about the ongoing Ogden City council race. It turns out, Mr. Wright reports, that the number of candidates (19) running for council seats is unprecedented, at least within the memory of City Clerk Gloria Berrett, an employee of 22 years.
Mr. Wright's story goes into a discussion of the political dynamics which have resulted in this long list of council candidates, and also provides information from background interviews. Anyone who intends to follow the council race from its very beginning will find this article a good starting point.
Among the quotes that Mr. Wright provides in this aticle is this one from incumbent Ogden City Council Vice-Chair and council candidate, Kent Jorgensen. It really is quite astonishing, I think:
Some of those who qualified to run have been outspoken critics of the incumbents, but Jorgenson defended them.
"Clearly we're making great strides and we're bringing in more business, we're not increasing taxes," he said. "We're clearly adding value, but for some reason we're not communicating that."
Jorgenson also said he feels there is a misperception that the council and administration are one and the same.
"I hope we're not lumped in to how people feel in general about what the mayor's doing, because a lot of times we don't have control over what his agenda is," he said.
There you have it, gentle readers. It's not Jorgensen and the city council "gang of five" who are "out of touch." The problem is that the citizens who've stepped up and committed to removing Mr. Jorgensen and his fellow incumbants from office are merely uninformed. For some odd reason they haven't gotten "the message," and don't understand what a great job Mr. Jorgensen and the gang of five have been doing for the citizens of Ogden -- or so says Councilman Jorgensen.
What say you, gentle readers? Is it the citizens of Ogden who are out of touch?
And what about the bulk of the city council? Is it true that it actually has a mind of its own?
29 comments:
I love to see all these names in the running for Council. One has to wonder if the citizens of Ogden are all 'peachy-keen' on the Mayor's grand plans. This is what the Mayor wants us to believe... that we are all happy about the tremendous progress that we see in downtown. I haven't seen this many names on the ballot since I have lived here. Me thinks that people might be a bit disgruntled.
Yeah, Rudi. I have a question you can ask these candidates.
Dian found these words in an Ogden City document that's on the Ogden city website:
"There is no excuse for continued failure to exercise legal authority to reclaim properties not properly managed, sufficient to produce public benefit, using the powers of eminent domain. The city should move aggressively to condemn problem properties, resale them to responsible property managers, move for aggressive evictions and tight asset management, or demolish them outright upon acquisition and establish a land banking strategy."
I want to know which canidiates believe in that sh**!
How many of them are for the Fatcats project?
I know a few of the candidates and hope to see Steven Prisbrey win the election. He is a guy that will really represent the people.
I'm glad to see so many concerned citizens running for office. I'd like to see both Kent and Donna get beat, Kent should lose because he is backed by big business, (he is a executive for the UTA) and Donna because she was appointed after Johnson resigned, and has admitted to not even being that interested in the job.
Rudi Tudi:
I would propose that you ask all of these council hopefuls any or all of the following questions:
Have you now, or ever in the past, been suspected of harboring dillusions of free money and or shown any other symptoms of the evil RDA disease?
What is your position on the city being involved in direct competition against private tax paying businesses?
What do you think about the various money making schemes the city has instituted to raise more money, ie the "good landlord" program?
What is your position on the Motel residents law recently passed?
What do you believe the city government's role should be in redevelopment?
Do you percieve the current city govenment to be arrogant and out of touch with the people, and if you do, what would you do to change it?
Do you believe in eminent domain seizure of private property for the benifit of private companies?
What would you do with the mall site if you had absolute control?
What would you do about the Marshal White center?
Would you be willing to advocate for fulll investigation of the Kemp and other RDA's that might not pass the smell test?
Would you take an oath to represent the citizens of Ogden and not a handfull of politicians and development operators?
Would you demand full disclosure to the council and the public before you voted on any issue placed before the council - including those proposals put forth by the big guy on nine?
Would you demand that the city practice full disclosure - in plain english - to all of the citizens on all of the issues and dealings of the city government?
Would you demand a full and honest and easy to understand accounting of all of the city RDA projects, how they interconnect, and how each one benefits the public in any tangible way? Also who the develpers, bankers and lawyers were and how much they made from each project.
Where do they stand on the Untied Nations doing business or having any other presence in Emerald City?
Would they be willing to pass a law that requires every home in the land of Oz to have a gun of at least 38 caliber and above?
Would they be willing to preside over the lord mayor's political funeral?
I am delighted to see that 16 challengers, along with 3 incumbents, have filed for City Council seats. I, like Toad and others, feel that the 16 are most likely "disgruntled" with what's been going on in that illustrious chamber as opposed to the spin that the Mayor puts on it about "a very positive thing," and "so many interested in being part of it." Possible he means that, but, still....
Anyway, it was interesting to see Jorgenson quickly distance himself from the "Administration," and hoping the Council wasn't being lumped in with the Mayor. Good lord, folks, he's part of the Gang of 6, the Mayor's first and foremost rubber stamp! And he doesn't tell the truth about tearing down the mall and wants to use eminent domain ruthlessly, to lure big business to town at the expense of other people's homes, just like the Mayor.
And then Safsten. This guy takes a literal slap at the challengers, insulting their intellect and abilities when he proclaims that all of these major league issues the Council is involved with isn't like "debating the color of fire hydrants." Who the hell does he think he is to suggest that fire hyrants are the only issue the challengers are worthy of discussing! One more insult towards the people by this other member of the Gang of 6. Contempt for our intelligence and abilities.
Good luck challengers and good luck Jesse Garcia. Your time has come. Our time has come. Bring city government back to the people.
And good luck to Jesse's challengers, too....I'm proud of all of you who have filed.
EC, with all due respect, I think you missed Safsten's point. I didn't interpret his comment as a slap in the face to challengers, but as an acknowledgement of them realizing the issues at hand- That indeed we are in an era of serious issues and not just "debating the color of fire hydrants". I look at that as a nod to all running that because of the serious nature of the issues, there are far more running.
Great posts, ozboy and ec, and jeremy---I do too.
I have been trying to find a current Weber County budget--the latest I could find posted was, once again, a PDF, and it was for 2004. I think it will be useful though.
The percentage of Weber County's sources of income to perform the services it does, and this list of services is quite sizable, are listed in 2004 as follows:
Property taxes: 51%
Charges for Services: 36%
Licenses, Permits, and Fees: 4%
Intergovernmental: 4%
Transfers In: 3%
Fines and Forfeitures: 1%
Misc.: 1%
The potential problem as I see it with all these projects in development that are having their property taxes routed back into themselves as increments, is that those increments are property tax money Weber County does not see.
Since the biggest chunk of Weber County's funds is from property taxes, worst case scenario is that the more development projects we do under the tax increment system, the less money Weber County sees. Weber County will then perhaps look around for other sources to shore up the property tax part of the fund, and since the taxes from redevelopment properties are tied up in increments, the individual and business property owners are next in line.
I seem to remember reading also that one of the reasons for demolishing the old Ogden City mall was that the city, after having bought it, had to pay the property taxes on it, which were sizable. Knocking it down reduced the amount of property taxes the city had to pay to Weber County for that parcel of land.
I would like this addressed to the candidates for City Council to see their feelings on it. Are these development projects taking as big a bite, or if they get going, are they projected to take such a bite, out of the Weber County property tax fund as it seems? I would like to see an analysis of the revenue Weber County would have received before these projects and then after. I realize that is complex, but facts and figures are what we need here to see what shape we are in.
If anybody wants to take a look at the Weber County 2004 budget, go to this link: BUDGET and download the 2004 PDF.
Amongst the candidates I found it amusing that Ogden's very own version of the "Energizer bunny" would throw his hat into the ring.
Just when we thought we had seen the last of good old tilting at windmills Mitch - Don Quixote - Moyes here he is again giving the good citizens a "choice"
He has great energy but very little brain power to go along with it. Sad and way past the point of being entertaining.
In spite of this, Mr. Quixote would still be a better council man that this revolting Larsen character who on a very regular basis so shamelessly prostrates himself at the feet of the lord mayor and his royal court on the council and grovels in his disgusting display of favor currying. I think in this day and age they call it "sucking up".
I fear that if the little lord mayor were to turn any corners real sharp that this class A sycophant Larsen could possibly suffer from a broken neck.
Does any one here know anything about the other two contenders for the late Mr. Filliaga's seat? If either one has an IQ higher than 58 they could be a distinct improvement in that chair.
Dian
You are on the money with your growing understanding of the evil RDA disease and its long reaching consequences that cause havoc in all other County, and State budgets. There is a ripple effect that goes through the whole economy when tens and even hundreds of millions of dollars get diverted into the greedy pockets of Bureaucrats, developers, bankers and the ever beloved lawyers.
All of course at the expense of the tax payers as witnessed by Weber County's ever rising property taxes.
Please keep on this subject and keep educating the public with your wonderful way of explaining stuff. (Perhaps this writing thing does have a genetic element to it?)
It will be a great public service if we can explain this unholy trinity of the RDA/MBA/City Council to our fellow citizens so that they can make informed decisions in the voting booth come November.
Lancer, it is indeed possible that I missed Safsten's point, but when I took in the man and the "complete" context of his message, I came away with my supposition. Rousing debate, to be sure, but Safsten has an arrogance about him and when he speaks of the public, it is generally in a discriminating attitude. To put it bluntly, the guy gives one the aire that his is to devine while the other's is to defer.
And dear Amy, I love what you said about the infrastructure and public services (and the fire hydrants as per the Planning Commission, which goes to my point regarding Saften's comment). Hopefully, Ms. Wicks, you get some much needed help come November. I'll be watching the preceedings with a very attentive eye.
Oh yeah, very good, Dian....very good.
All of this goes toward a REAL FINE blogsite. Thanks to all.
I appreciate that, Bonnie Lee. And I absolutely agree with what Amy has said, that the focus of City Administration should be on things other than RDA projects.
The reason I keep hammering at the project part of it is that there seems to be the attitude among some members of the Ogden City Council that as long as Ogden City itself does not raise taxes, the Ogden City Administration is not accountable for a tax hike because it's not they who are doing it.
My opinion is that this attitude shows a lack of understanding on the part of the city administration regarding the symbiotic relationship between Weber County, Ogden City administration, and those of us who live here. We are all separate, true, but when Ogden City goes cutting into Weber's fund via tax increments and additional tax increments, it might have a very negative effect on us, the taxpayers.
What I really want to know is how much of an effect? I want to know the current dollar figure of how much money is tied up in tax increments, both additional ones and basic ones. And I would also like to know future projections on this regarding these projects. Because that is money that would otherwise be going to Weber County to use on our services.
If they say---Oh,, this is negligible, these increments are really no problem; we are more than able to absorb these small losses from our fund caused by all these projects---I will say fine, and then ask why then, are they proposing an increase?
I was thinking, too, that one of the problems here is that the number of these projects splits focus. Union Square. The Rec Center. The Gondola. The Riverfront. Etc. These are great to discuss, true. But should we all become focussed on whether or not we are for or against specific projects, we will miss the point that there are quite a few in the works with very steep costs, and our real question is will we, the taxpayers, have to absorb all of that? If so, how much, for how long, and at what cost to our basic quality of life?
Or, as Ozboy said elsewhere, should these projects run out of money and snag, will we be living in an area comprised of large tracts of land that are owned by various banks, bonding companies, and lenders, who will not be accountable to us at all and can do whatever they want with them?
There is really so much at stake here, and not only for the present, but for years into our future.
"The more things change, the more they stay the same"--anybody know the French for that?
In answer to Rudi's question: Is it the citizens of Ogden who are out of touch? I refer you to this article in KAYAK MAGAZINE. (Hope that link translates--am just learning this.}
This article sounds so familiar I am thinking it might have been originally published in the Standard. The date on it is March 11th, 2002, and it was written after the Ogden City Council Voted Down the Riverfront Project.
"...With Fasi Filiaga absent because of illness, the council voted Feb. 26 against adopting the boundaries of the project, ending what the administration said is a year of work developing the proposal. The vote was a tie, with council members Rick Safsten, Mark Johnson and Kent Jorgenson for the project, and Jesse Garcia, Vice-chairwoman Mary Hall and Chairman Ken Alford opposed.
Alford cast the final vote, saying the tie meant the motion failed. Only a dissenting member can ask for a revote under Ogden Redevelopment Agency rules. The council was sitting as the RDA board for the vote.
Almost as soon as Alford had finished uttering his vote, he and Godfrey clashed.
"The people of Ogden," the angry mayor said, "have been waiting 34 years for something to happen . . ." at which point Alford cut him off, saying, "The people voted down the river parkway project mayor," referring to a city bond election 10 years ago where five proposed projects were all voted down at the polls.
"The council is so out of touch with the people of this town it"s ridiculous," Godfrey said after the vote. "To say we have to go slow after all the years nothing was being done in this town is ridiculous, and the people of Ogden should know who"s to blame."
He wasn"t any calmer the next day. "They"ve screwed up everything with this decision. This is huge. I can"t tell you what a major setback this is. . . . But we"re not giving up. This project has to happen for the downtown to be successful..."
There's more. Thought you might find that interesting, to say the least, especially the part about the people of the city of Ogden voting down 5 projects in a bond election, one of which might have been the Riverfront.
That's what I call WORLD-CLASS GOOGLING, Dian.
Thank you very much for the "kayak" link.
It's also good to see you've done your homework on the posting of "anchored" html web links.
For those who are relatively computer savvy, and want to try "embedding" webpages with text links like Dian and others have done, here's a handy-dandy bare-bones general glossary of html tags. Some of it works in blogger.com comments -- most of it doesn't. You never know until you try it, though.
If the above description sounds like Sanskrit to you...
Don't even think about trying it.
It's interesting to see Kent Jorgensen attempt to distance himself from the mayor today in the Standard Examiner, ecspecially after he has voted for virtually EVERYTHING the mayor has proposed...Hey Kenty boy do you feel the water getting warmer?
Interesting it is, isn't it? And the PR lady just at the inception of elections season. And the 2 Councilmen who were quoted in the newspaper....equal time, people, equal time. They should have had one incumbent and one challenger.
With the tax increments and the evils of RDA, the City in its own way does raise taxes in another, subtle way, rarely questioned. And that is the "impact fees" and other ordinance producing "cash cows, like the new Court System, that quietly remove the dollars from our pockets and put in the coffers. User fees, increased rates, they all play a roll here, and when the Gang of 6 claim "there just ain't no tax increases," its a bare faced lie....they just call these raises "fees." The Landlord Program, probalby first in line, is another example of fee raising and a shot at the middle class, who are systematically being disenfranchised by City Government.
Not "lumping" the majority of the Council (I had to smile when Jorgenson used the entire Council, as there are a couple of well meaning members who NEVER rubber stamp) is another crock, and I'm thinking that we can get used to hearing the "spin" coming from those 5 members who grovel at Godfrey's feet.
These post are absolutley on target, and bring much to consider. I'm sure the candidates will use much of what's being written here. I'm also pleased to see the recent turn-around of the Standard Examiner's Op/Ed editors, and I must say thanks and it is about time.
The City Council meeting was cancelled tonight, as they felt they had nothing to address. I guess they got the infrastructure and public services taken care of during the week (interesting how things move along, once the heat is on). Next week, allegedly, the sh--hits the fan with Public Hearings scheduled (again) and RDA, MBA also scheduled. I guess this week the incumbents didn't want to gaze out at the audience and see their challengers all watching and listening.
This could be exciting....
>>>Check out the real story at bernlaw.blogspot.com<<<
Yeah right, anonymous.
A blog with one post and no comments.
F*** you're stupid.
Queen of denial,
look before you speak.
I'm Bob, the Write-In Candidate. I will now take exception to Councilman Jorgenson's remarks, "I hope we're not lumped in to how people feel in general about what the mayor's doing, because alot of times we don't have control over what his agenda is." Well, BS, Kent. Every time you vote, you have control over what the mayor's agenda is.
Now, even though you people at City Hall don't post here, I know you are reading this blog. The newspaper reads this blog. Anyone with a lick of common sense who is politically affiliated, reads this blog. Therefore, Kent Jorgenson, put your money where your mouth is. I want you to show us 1, that's right, one, item of agenda that the mayor has proposed, that you and those other 4 councilmen (one woman there) have not voted in favor of. Just one item. Can you do it? Can you show us that you are not "lumped in" with the mayor's agenda and where, only once, you voted against him?
Bet you can't.
And hey, Utah, just who the hell is the queen of denial? Please tell us and what you mean by your most recent posting.
This Bernie dude - the first brother in law - is trying to get people to hit his site to build up its credibility.
On his site is a fairly well written piece on the two tram schemes. Great ideas as he presents them but totally full of blue sky and mayorial like promises with absoulutely no proof of viability at all. This sort of thing has traditionally been known as "pipe dreamin".
A peyote pipe would be especially helpfull to catch the vision the mayor, his family and their pack of development gnomes are trying to foist upon the poor working people of Emerald City.
By the way there is no debate or discussion going on at bernie's site. It seems like people are staying away in droves.
I would urge you to resist the urge to even look which will deny the bro-in-law and lord mayor the satisfaction of those hit numbers. But if you must, it aint a bad read for a fiction piece.
Definitely, the bern-site sucks flat big time. Tainted features with no way to post. Blowhard stuff, slanted toward, you guessed it, the little lord mayor.
Bob,
See post directly above mine
Ozboy,
interesting speculation, but probably untrue. "bernie" does not have the faintest idea how to do a blog, but is trying to learn to do so. As soon as I can give him a little tutorial on the little I know about blogging, hopefully his site will be a bit more organized. So hold of on judgement, I believe that "bernie" can plead ignorance on this one.
Hey UtMo,
if your buddy the little mayor's brother in law can plead ignorance on something, why can't the mayor who is truly ignorant on a vast array of stuff?
I would guess that if this Bernie the broinlaw gets to closely associated with you that he will lose all street cred just like you did.
Oh and yea you been putting yourself out there as a defender of the public money spending binge that the council and mayor have been on, so tell me - what do you make of Jorgensen acting like a rat leaving a sinking ship?
Ignorance is NEVER an excuse, not in law, not in politics, not in journalism. Who are you guys, anyway?
Apparently water does seek and find it's own level.
It was nice to see Ogden has a horse race at all.
In today's Stdex the two stories about candidates indicated that of 35 cities reported, 10 do not have a contested race for mayor. (One of them didn't have anyone file for mayor). Pretty sad state.
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