Read this and weep, fellow Ogdenites. While the Ogden City neocon council faction (Safsten, Jorgenson, Burdett, Stevenson and Filiaga) fiddles around and plays "Big Time Real Estate Developer" downtown, the infrastructure of the rest of this town crumbles under our very feet.
Call me old fashioned, I guess, but I'd naively thought that maintaining the basic culinary water supply was supposed to be one of the first priorities of municipal government.
There's an election coming up in November, citizens of Ogden.
It's time to vote some of these "asleep-at-the-wheel" Ogden City council incumbent Donald Trump wannabes OUT!
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30 comments:
Maybe the Mayor and the counsel simply think that Ogdenites need a bit more iron in their diet.
I personally know of two people who have had their basements flooded recently by the city's aging water pipes. Luckily, neither had the sewage pipes break, although a little digging might well prove that this is the case for some.
Who needs water to the home anyway when we can have a bowling alley, a high-tech recreation center, and yet another office complex? (Has anyone noticed the amount of available office space in Ogden?) We could all just mosey down to the High-Tech center and drink our water from the wave/surf pool.
I think it is some dubious plot to drive instant "foot-traffic" to the rec center.
Maybe they (the City Council and Mayor) can do away with the roads and utilities next and build an even greater edifice to show how truly great they are.
(P.S. I am going to spell this out... this post is dripping with sarcasm, and should not be considered a truly marvelous economic study and plan for the future. Please do not actually try this plan. Thanks.)
Whatcha been smokin' Mr. President?
Can I have a little toke?
Anonymous put some sort of a name on, anonymous is so gay. You sound like your as old as the hills like my grandma who stresses about going to the grocery store.
Dear me, the president has spoken, and once again has held to pattern and come off as a dolt. Rusty water? Old farts? Crappin your pants? just to mention a few. And this same guy thinks he can explain the tax base and gondola system; but won't. Now, what's a person to do?
My gawd. Isn't this the same guy who thought the infrastructure was a $25,000,000 repair deal? Quite obviousl he doesn't know what the hell the infrastructure consists of and why it just might be important to address immediately, before it swallows us. Hold on good people, there is hope....if we're lucky, it will swallow this president guy first.
Ah----youth. It demands a step back and the taking of a breath. At least we have Utmorman, an individual who shows class in his posts, is willing to learn, and comes across as being pretty darn smart and logical. Now this guy's the kind opf person one can write home about. If not quite now, the lad is well on his way as an example of what the younger generation is all about. An ambassador of passing the torch potential. Like I wrote earlier, I'm quickly becoming a fan because of the character he brings to the table.
Let him be an example to you, president. Try to behave now, even though it's way past your bedtime. If you do, we might let you play with the blocks, provided you know what kind of battery they take.
"a little bit of rusty water," Mr. president?
I sat in on a city council meeting a few weeks ago, when one of the residents up there on 23d street complained that his tap poured out chunks of rusty metal every time he opened it up. This has been going on for friggin' years, he said.
The problem's a little bit worse than you seem to understand, or want to admit.
Try to keep up.
Here are the neocons who need to be fired in November:
>Jorgenson
>Burdett
>Filiaga.
Mr. President I did not read your second post, before I posted, I apolagize I have not been getting much sleep because my neighbors trailer caught fire, and spread to my trailer, oh it was a hell of a night, anyways I'm sorry man.
I would hope that this intelligent "anonymous" would actually use another name to differentiate him/her from the moron who also uses the "anonymous" moniker. I liked this "anonymous" post with it's funny "sarcasm" and cutting witt. He sure has the powers that be in Ogden pegged!
It was a bit dissapointing to see the re-appearance of "president". They must be getting pretty loose on their leave policy at the state hospital for the inane and insane. He is obviously stuck in the "anal" stage as his posts are all centered around his favorite word - fart! Oh so naughty Mr. President. Now take your medication and stand in the corner.
As some one pointed out in another thread - these poor diluted souls are one of the inconveniences we must suffer in this blogosphere.
His poor grandma was probably stressing about the obvious degeneration of her blood line, not the trip to the grocery store.
Oh well, God must love idiots like this, She sure made a lot of them.
Right on Enthused Citizen! I laughed my ass off when I read your post. Whoops, I hope I am not regressing to that "anal" stage Bonnie Lee wrote about! God forbid I should be locked in the time out room with our esteemed poopy pants Mr. President!
I would like to comment on the subject of this post but fear that the original "anonymous" might castigate me for being the 12th commenter on the subject. I would hate for him to loose his ranch over me not being first.
CAUTION-CAUTION
IDENTITY THEFT!
Right here on the blog. The 2nd enthused citizen. Just has to be the president, scrambling, hiding, seeking support. One look at this train wreck writting skills, the sadness portrayed therein, with a comparison to other presidential postings, and ya'll will see what I mean.
Ozboy, that ranch stuff's funny. I'm sure that by now, all bets are off....
You rock.
"Train Wreck WRITTING Skills."
"Writting" skills?!?!?!?!
tsk, tsk, tsk.
Well, so tell me then, do I get the compliment, or not (channel the sarcasm)?
It is rather sad that such a serious subject as presented here has been hijacked by a bunch of amatuer comedians and low grade juvenile illiterates. Does any one out there have anything intelligent to add to this important situation facing all of Ogden citizens?
It seems to me to be a very sad situation that our Mayor and Council occupy their time with all of these development projects while the city falls apart all around us. It is very much like the legend of Nero fiddling while Rome burned.
If the city council meetings are any indication, the basic needs of the city are for the most part ignored. I have been to maybe a dozen council meetings in the last few months and it is a very rare occasion to have any basic infastructure needs addressed by them. My guess is that at least 90 percent of the attention goes to one of these development schemes or another.
If you look at the cities top employee charts you will see the vast majority of the $80 to $120 thousand a year positions all have to do with development. I believe the number is around eight. With their staffs and perks that is well over a Million dollars a year that drains out of our pockets into theirs. That is just in personel costs, that does not build anything.
If you have the courage to dig into the city financial statements you will see that there is not one single project the city has undertaken in the Mayor's tenure that has returned one red cent to the city coffers. In fact in the whole sorry history of RDA's in Utah there has never been even one that has panned out and actually returned a profit to the tax paying citizens. Profit includes any sort of tax relief which is one of the main selling points used to convince the people that RDA's will be good for them.
The Mayor and Council has repeatedly lost tens of millions of our tax dollars on these ill advised projects. The more millions lost the more projects they come up with. They just shrug off the losses, declare success, and go on to the next big deal. They really are insatiable in their quest for glory at the expense of the citizens.
This RDA fever that has consumed our Mayor and the majority of the council is the most insidious scam ever perpetrated on the people in the history of our fair city.
I fully agree with Rudi, these poor council members seem to be incurable and desperately need to be replaced in November: Jorgensen, Burdett and Filliaga. We need to come together at the ballot box and stop this madness before this group ruins the fabric of Ogden drives the city into complete bankruptcy.
Now, I am not going to claim to know the situation, so if my facts are wrong you all have permission to jump all over me as has become the standard when I say something without researching my facts. Having a certain experience in construction, I can tell you that rusty water coming out of taps is not clearly the cities problem. My house was built in 1925, it has old pipes. Rust can come in because of MY pipes too. My pipes are as old if not older than the ones that are the responsibility of the city. You have to understand that the city's pipes are generally the ones that run from the street to your water meter, after that it is usually your responsibility and your pipes. Even today, when you build a building, it is your responsibility to run the tie-ins to the city's system. If you or your sub-contractor does not do it correctly, or did not do it correctly 80 years ago, than there is a definate possibility of rust and other substances (even lead, which is a much bigger problem). Heck, even if it is done correctly, problems can occur.
Now, what I have said may not be the case in this house on 23rd street,or others for that matter, but it may be the case elsewhere.
Also, it is not prudent to simply clear Garcia and Wicks on this one. They sat in on the budget work sessions too. They help determine where money goes also. While they may not be at fault as much as you claim the other's to be, they still carry some blame with them. Rudi has said that he prefers them, but remember that they have the same responsibility as everyone else.
Well folks, if I have said things that are off base, let me know.
By the way, Filiagi is not running again for health reasons.
Utmorman:
You are correct in most of what you represent, however in this particular instance the city has already accepted that it is not the home owner's pipes that are the problem. Remember the one home owner that has replaced their pipes and found no cure. In any particular home's pipe rust problem, the rust will clear out very quickly with each use. I believe these people get mostly rusty water most of the time.
The city water system problems go far beyond this particular rust situation in this area. It is city wide, not the rust necessarily but other major problems with pressure valves and deteriorating pipes.
I also must suggest that you are off base in assigning partial blame to Garcia and Wicks. The vote is predominately 5 to 2 on most of these important issues. Garcia and Wicks of course being the 2 votes. The 5 votes pass any given issue. Therefore the fault, if their is fault, goes to the 5 aye votes which typicaly is Safsten, Jorgensen, Burdett, Stevenson and Filliaga. It is very rare that there is any variation to this theme. They are the Mayor's team there is no doubt about it.
It has been my observation that Garcia and Wicks are always for a reasonable approach and they are very concerned with the citizens in all of their actions on the council. They are the only bright spots in an other wise dismal picture.
You are a refreshing presence on this blog and I appreciate your input.
Another argument that I would like to bring up is the one that president partially made. I agree that the rec. center thing is dragging on, but we may need those things to happen first in order to create a tax base. We need A LOT of improvements in this city, however none of it will ever happen if there is not money generated by taxes to to do it with. I believe that once we have more businesses downtown with more people spending money across the board (remember that stats show that 25th Street actually did comparibly better when the mall was there), then at that point the city can have a tax base and do the things that they need to do. There are definately problems here, but they are not going to go away if we don't use the money on the rec. center or other projects. Remember that the money being used is RDA money, not fix water pipes money. It cannot be used for things other than RDA projects.
The recurring theme that keeps coming up is: what else is there to do? Are we just going to ditch our plans, waste all the money used to plan the projects, and spend the money on fixing infrastructure? We can secong guess all we want, but something had and has to be done in Ogden to generate money, and though the council members may have taken a chance by trying to develop downtown, to me it is refreshing to finally have taken a chance in this town instead of treading along in a depressed state. Plans have not been submitted by those who tend to criticize. Correction, Mr. Moyes proposed that the money from the rec. center be used to make a Smithsonium Museum in the Union Stathon laundry building, however, that was quickly and swiftly proved to be an invalid option by Councilwoman Burdett.
Until valid plans are proposed, keep second guessing but know that you are not truly fixing the problem.
Well said UtMorman Go Gondola. Wicks and Garcia should not recieve a free pass on this.
The never ending debate over the recreation center continues, I see. Why is it that the hopes of our city are pinned to this one particular project, especially in the light of so many other failed projects that were initiated by this same bunch in City Hall?
I read a pretty informative article in this morning's paper, by Wayne April, that should give one pause. I myself have been critical, maybe not so much at the recreation center itself, but in the way its inception has and is being administered. Many unanswered questions remain, such as feasibility studies, the finanical strength of the Gold's Gym and Fat Cats groups, the enormous amount of dollars committed to the project that essentially use up every single revenue stream the city has from tax increment funds, and so on.
Yes, something has to be done downtown, and maybe the recreation center is it. But the unanswered questions, the delays, the gamble, the people behind it, all of this makes me wonder how much this whole show will really cost and what will the final outcome be for our city, once the dust has settled.
Meanwhile, public service, infrastructure, et al goes on, without a whole lot of attention being paid to it.
I'm going to weigh in on the infrastructure discussion here. Ogden City is aging and we have some pressing (and not so pressing) needs with our water, sewer and streets. I believe that along with public safety, the infrastructure needs of the city should be one of the top priorities with city government.
Much of the City Council's (and Council Staff) time is spent on Redevelopment Agency projects. Coming up with time to address the Capital Improvement Master Plan and other important issues is sometimes difficult. In order to survive several very lean budget years capital improvement projects were put on hold or dropped. We are now picking up the pieces, re-prioritizing and trying to address the most pressing needs in the city with an updated master plan.
The rusty tap water problem is not an issue with the pipes in the resident's homes, it is a problem with the Ogden City owned water system in the neighborhood. It is a costly problem to fix, but every resident in the city deserves clean water.
Several years ago the council decided to put 50% of future profits from BDO into capital improvement projects. Now it looks like that money is going to be used to pay back loans for the mall development.
With this funding source potentially being diverted, in order to address all of the issues, we may need to increase rates, bond for larger projects and hopefully have increased money in the general fund through all of the development projects our staff is devoting so much time and effort to.
Thank you,
I stand corrected.
Yo Enthused Citizen:
You hit the nail on the head on this subject - again.
Keep em coming and keep on this city's butt.
The good people of Emeral City need a guy like you to stand up and be counted...
Oh - and Amy Wicks, every time I see you or hear you or read your writings I get a little weak in the knees and feel this little tingle up my spine. Could it be love?
As one wise sage stated in a council meeting last winter "She is like a smoldering volcano!" Oh so true! Beauty and brains in one wonderful package working for all the citizens of our great city. How fortunate we are.
Keep up the good work, the desperate citizens of Emerald City turn their shining eyes toward you and the great Mr. Garcia for relief from all this maddness that has overcome city hall
It appears that Ms. Wicks has basically supported my assertions in the last paragraph of my most recent post (and I agree Ozboy....beauty and brains all in one package, wrapped with the soundness of thought and compassion for the people....a rare commodity indeed. We're fortunate to have MS. Wicks, and Mr. Garcia, as part of the checks and balances that are oh so necessary in government today). I'm delighted to see that I wasn't up in the night when I penned my last post, as this fine Councilperson is one who would know the facts.
There's concern among both she and Jesse Garcia about the aging and deteriorated infrastructure; unfortunately the others, whom I refer to as the Gang of 6, go merrily along their way, committing funds, cooming up with impact fee schemes, and bulldozing this recreation center idea while Rome burns. I'm afraid I have to liken their ways to somebody rushing out to fix their mailbox while their house is on fire.
Probably, the recreation center is past the point of no return. If, like in that famous 1950's movie of the same name, John Wayne were piloting this thing, I might feel somewhat more comfortable. Unfortunately, we have a mayor who insists on wearing blinders and who apparently is paying less and less attention to the overall state of things in Ogden. Everything is now either pledged to this recreation center project or is in some way dependent upon its successful outcome. I shudder to think of the state of things if any one card should fall. Maybe Wayne April isn't far from the truth.
Ms. Wicks certainly cleared up the misconception regarding rusty pipes. Most likely, the same is true about the streets, sewer and other conditions. I'm stunned that the capital improvements section of the 2006 City Budget only received a pitiful $5-6 million for corrections, while at the same time the interest on the City loans themselves, mostly dead horse loans at that, are bleeding the cash cow to death.
Oh that our esteamed council be multi-taskers, thereby addressing many issues instead of spending all of their time trying to ramrod this mall project through. But I suppose its gotten down to that. At least the Gang of 6 can share the blame, or the glory, with the "thousands of citizens" (Godfrey's quote) who encouraged this high adventure recreation center idea.
Isn't it remarkable that a person like this "president" fellow, a person who can't spell or structure a meaningful post, would call an obviously educated and well meaning person like the Enthused Citizen, "Trailer Trash."
In 12 Step programs, when somebody defiles someone else, it's thought that it's usually themself that they're refering to. I'm sure that this applies here. Mr. president is obviously spending way too much time looking in his mirror, not liking what he sees, and then assigning his faults to others. After reading the nonsense he spews forth, that's the only possible explanation. It can't be chalked up to youth or attempted humour.
Now, if were moving to fast for you, president, let us know and we can slow it down a tad. Maybe then, you could contribute something worthwhile instead of offering us these inane remarks from a such a simpleton's point of view.
What was it someone said about "blocks?"
Enough said, er, read, president. Enthused Citizen, other real contributors, I forgot one other possibility: this dunce hat wearing president dope is in DENIAL!
Heck sakes, he doesn't even realize how sad he really is. I actually feel sorry that he embarrasses himself the way he does. He can't even come in out of the dark.
The president catching a flight? A flight to fantasy. They have rules there, president, and you don't pass. They won't let you pass GO, they won't let you collect $200. They won't let a guy like you do anything. How are you getting access to the computer? I know, you're going to that lunatic's store, SIMPLY AWESOME COMPUTERS and taking theirs for a test drive Thye have schools, instructors there and everything. Even uniforms. What's your favorite color and who'se your favorite band?
I know you're crying out for acceptance, but if you want to be taken seriously, then you have to act seriously. You must behave, be a good little Boy Scout, always prepared, and accept your shortcomings and lot in life. There was this one other guy, a guy who ran for mayor a couple of times, named Larry Lader or something like that. I wonder, maybe you're a clone of his. He was a janitor and garbage man (gave those hard working people a bad name) and he, ah, what the hell, let's suffice it to say that he was a semi-quazi half wit who gave us much entertainment and enlightened us to our dark side. As nuts as this guy was, he did have a smattering of intelect and humor about him, he just directed it in the wrong way. You should call him and take some lessons before you go on. Much can be learned.
Your crackers and milk are ready. Toddle off, partake, then catch your nap. Evening will be here before you know it and Larry will be off work.
president, are you really mitch moyes in disquise, trying to fool us all?
"Why don't you come out of the closet another view."
Can anyone tell me what this group of words means? Is it a question or a statement or what?
And president wonders why we don't listen.
Rudi, you may begin the process.
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