"Chamber backs gondola plan," the screaming headline declares. "Project, resort touted a "unique economic development opportunity," the Standard-Examiner editors would lead us to believe.
We dunno about that. The following text incorporates the actual language that the Chamber Board reportedly adopted. Somehow we don't see it as exactly coming off as a "ringing endorsement:"
The board adopted a position statement Thursday in support of Peterson’s concept and initial proposal, describing it as a “work in progress.”What the Chamber Board appears to have done, based on the language provided in the article, is to merely to endorse the fact-gathering public process which the Ogden City Council has previously endorsed. That appears though, gentle readers, to be "just about it. "
“We are committed to continued review and input on the project to ensure the best possible results for all concerned,” the statement says. “The Ogden/Weber Chamber of Commerce pledges to provide accurate and updated information as the project develops and details are refined based on community input.” [Emphasis added.]
What the Chamber Board seems to be saying here is that they're keeping their eyes and ears open just like the rest of the rational citizens of Ogden City and environs. Like the rest of us, they're obviously still awaiting the nuts-and-bolts details, such as how much it will all cost, and who will be expected to pay for it.
Careful readers will notice that the only ringing endorsements actually found in this ridiculous article are those that come from the pack of usual suspects, -- and NOT from the Chamber Board itself.
Dave Hardman is clearly in love with the proposal. Of course, we already knew that. Nowhere is there a mind-numbed gondola lemming more committed to the Peterson/Godfrey landgrab than the slavish Godfreyite Dave Hardman. No well-attended landgrab promotional event ever occurs without Dave Hardman standing up in front of the crowd, with that big "good-ole-boy" grin plastered on his face, preaching about the sheer wonderfulness of the gondola "silver bullet. "
Just for laughs, we hope our gentle readers will read today's Schwebke spin-masterpiece, and carefully compare and contrast the extremely cautious language of the Chamber Board statement with the hyperbolic and frenzied pronouncements of Dave Hardman, Matt Godfrey and Chris Peterson.
If anything, we believe the Chamber Board's own statement actually operates as nothing more than a damnation by faint praise, at this early juncture at least, notwithstanding the mendacious and wholly transparent efforts of some people to spin this story another way.
And what do our gentle readers think this morning?
What is your take on all this?
Update 5/27/06 1:24 p.m. MT: We thank gentle reader Dian a second time today for her diligent contributions to this community blog. The Ogden-Weber Chamber has indeed posted the full text of their Thursday "position statement" on their website, although it is functionally invisible to readers with screen resolutions set to 800x600 and lower (50% of our readers and our humble blogger included.) To read the full text, you may go to their site, and scroll to the right. There you will find a graphic image link.
We've reviewed the full text "statement," and stand by our initial assessment, BTW. Although the statement refers to and incorporates a series of assumptions that might as well have been cut & pasted from the Lift Ogden site, the thrust of the Chamber Board's position remains clear:
They're obviously okay with the basic concept (as are many of our gentle readers,) assuming the assumptions can be proved-out. Still, the Chamber Directors await the all-important details with bated breath, most of which have been INTENTIONALLY withheld to date.
The call for much more information couldn't be more clear -- even from the Ogden-Weber Chamber Directors, who've been mercilessly pushed for weeks by their dipshit "Director," to issue some kind of pro-Godfrey "statement."
Sidebar question: Who the hell is Godfrey-shill Dave Hardman anyway? And how the hell did THIS GUY wind up as the ostensible spokesman for a group of pragmatic Ogden City/Weber County business entrepreneurs like me who put their own money on the line every day, and slave away to make their small businesses work?
So many questions...
14 comments:
The Ogden Weber Chamber of Commerce website shows four individuals comprising the Board of Directors and seven on staff. Don't more people sit on the Board than four?
Here's the link:
Ogden Weber Chamber Board and Staff
Thanks for the link, Dian.
Notably, WSU's Ann Milner apparently has a seat on the Board, according to today's Schwebke story, although her name doesn't appear on the Chamber's website roster.
So many questions...
The Ogden Weber Chamber of Commerce site also has the position statement on a PDF. I will attempt to copy it in full here:
OGDEN/WEBER CHAMBER OF COMMERCE
POSITION STATEMENT
MALAN’S BASIN DEVELOPMENT
5/25/2006
The Ogden/Weber Chamber of Commerce is committed to responsible economic development in
Northern Utah. The Board of Directors recognizes the Malan’s Basin Development is one of the
most significant economic development opportunities ever presented to our community ($500
million private investment and 1200 new jobs).
The Board of Directors of the Ogden/Weber Chamber of Commerce supports the concept and
initial proposal of the Malan’s Basin Development recognizing that the development is a work in
progress. We are committed to continued review and input on the project to ensure the best
possible results for all concerned. The Ogden/Weber Chamber of Commerce pledges to provide
accurate and updated information as the project develops and details are refined based on
community input.
The following are key elements regarding the proposed Malan’s Basin Project:
· Construction of a community gondola system will connect the inter-modal hub in central
Ogden to Weber State University and continue to the resort base east of the University. The
community gondola system will provide direct access from commuter rail and central Ogden to
the east bench, Weber State University and the resort.
· A mountain gondola will connect the resort base to Malan’s Basin where a year-round green
(road-less) resort village will be built by private investment. The mountain resort will include
ski and recreation facilities, accommodations, housing, shops and restaurants.
· The sale of the Mount Ogden Golf Course property will take place in return for a much
improved golf facility open to the public with special fees for locals. Mount Ogden and
Marquardt Parks will remain Ogden City parks and be improved with funding from the
Developer.
· Proceeds from the sale of the golf course property will pay for the majority of the community
gondola system and the remainder will be funded through private sources. No new taxes
and/or bonding will be needed or committed to build the project.
· The sale of Weber State University property above and south of 36th Street will accommodate
the expanded golf course, resort base and housing development.
· The proposed development will provide additional tax dollars to help our city grow and prosper
and will support public education.
· The project will include an improved and expanded trail system with free access for all nonmotorized
use.
The Chamber will continue to be involved in the development process to assure the best interest
of our community, the University and businesses. The Ogden/Weber Chamber Board of Directors
urges the local business community to become aware and involved in the proposed development
process and its significance to Ogden and Weber County.
They have even written a letter of support that one can download, print off, and send in stating this support.
So from this, it looks like they do indeed support it. The Board, at any rate. To my knowledge the members did not vote on this or anything, but perhaps they leave decisions like this up to the Board.
Here is the link to the page the PDF is on:
Malan's Basin Development Information
The Mayor is insidiously working behind the scene's promoting this scheme with all his time and energy. Meanwhile the city business that he should be doing goes undone, the roads continue to deteriorate, the sewer is still on the brink of collapse, the water still comes out yellow from the taps up on east 23rd Street, and our Cops are still being ignored and walked out on.
The Standard Examiner continues to down play the true nature of the gondola oposition. This is the second time I have seen the opponents to this very dangerous idea defined this way by the SE: "detractors believe it could eliminate valuable open space and trails"
This of course is only one of many objections that rational people in Ogden have with this scheme. Nowhere does the SE ever write about what an incredibly dangerous financial project that this could be to Ogden citizens now and on into the future.
Taking the gondola project that is currently underway in Portland as an example, it is very possible and likely that the current projection of $20 million for the down town leg could balloon to $50 or a $100 million dollars.
A very real possibility with this whole plan is this:
The city sells off the golf course for $20 million (less than a third of it's true value) and puts that money into starting the city gondola.
The gondola costs escalate to $50 million, which means the tax payers of Ogden have to come up with an extra $30 million out of the general fund.
Meanwhile the golf course and surrounding park property are lost forever to the citizens of Ogden.
Peterson cannot sell enough of the 400 one million dollar homes to build the up mountain gondola or resort. He takes a hike after wringing every penny he can out of the golf course and park land. His whole end of things ends up in BK court.
Ogden is stuck with an enormous white elephant to compliment our other, as yet to be built, white elephant called the "High Tech Rec Center.
Ogden city goverment collapses under the bone crushing debt load associated with these debacles and has to be bailed out by it's property owners and tax payers.
The Mayor meanwhile has gone on to his "greater glory" with Boyer Company, and or his church. He blames the wholesale failer of every thing he did while mayor on the "naysayers" who didn' t appear by the millions to ride the gondola and wind tunnel.
Not his fault! It is the people's fault for not believing in his "visions".
After twenty years of maintenance nightmares, low ridership and obscene operating costs, the derilect eye sore of a gondola has to be torn down by our children at enormous costs.
Meanwhile the prisitne golf course and park property is still lost forever to the citizens of Ogden.
Unlikely? It remains to be seen, but in my many years of observing and participating in business, government and industry, I believe this scenario is much more likely than the pap and pipe dreams that is being extensively marketed by the Mayor, Peterson, Schwepke, and Hartman.
Ozboy, you forgot the part of people turning to substance abuse, rape, pillage and murder that will ultimately take place. . . when the gondola doesn't work?
I'm not a fan of the gondola but I don't think that building it will usher in the destruction man and leave our kids home, job and life-less.
As an avid mountain biker and outdoor enthusiast, I want to see Ogden remain (somewhat) status quo. We love it for it's nature, uniqueness and feeling of being far away, yet still in town. This will all change when the all might dollar brings "new" trails and houses. Our leaders want so bad to become the next CA, yet seem to totally ignore the reason CA is moving here!
Am I the only one that feels punched-in-the-gut when I read that they'll re-route trails? Are you serious? So, when forced to make a decision between completing the newest CA escapee's house or fixing my bike trail, I'll get the preferential treatment?
I've lived in Milwaukee and Chicago and I can tell you what happens when money takes over the care of "Nature's trails." It's not pretty and it's anything but nature. How oxymoronic will it be to market Ogden's nature--leading you right through multi-million dollar homes a golf course and a Tram?
So, here's to Smartgrowthogden.org and their approach to actually thinking about moves and involving the vox populi.
I'm still waiting to hear what Weber State University has to say about this subject. If you have any information. Will you please post it?
Ozboy brought up my thoughts exactly. After reading the latest hype today, I also noticed that only the trails and green space are mentioned as reasons we 'naysayers' or 'detractors' are against the gondola/Peterson buy-out.
Portland, OR knows first hand how costs escalate. They are over $57,000,000. NOW and still their tram (same as a gondola) is not completed. They thought it would done for FIVE million!!
Every time I read Matt's $20,000.000. price tag for the 'downtown leg to WSU', I feel sick to my stomach.
Other cities in the Top of Utah are tightening their collective belts and stopping or modifying construction on some of their projects because of escalating costs.
Whenever we 'detractors' are mentioned in any article, nothing is ever brought up of our objections to the paucity of information from Peterson and gang, his lack of home development experience and expertise. The lack of feasiblity studies, etc. WHO are the private investors who will pick up the tab OVER the projected TWENTY MILLION?
If all this hinges on WSU giving up their land, and the rumors are rampant that the Brd of Regents ain't gonna let that happen...then why the *&$#@&* doesn't MS Milner put an end to this by telling us the truth? Is the Brd seriously considering Peterson's land grab or not??? Hmmm?
What did happen at the P & D show Wed? Did Peterson actually answer questions all by himself?
I'm not confident that the C of C Brd is only disseminating info. It would appear, to me, that they, sans Milner, are buying into Godfrey's vision.
Kent Jorgenson's opinion piece about this issue is in the Salt Lake Tribune today. I read it here a few weeks ago---can't remember if the Standard ran it also. Am also not sure if it's the exact same one. Jorgenson's core suggestion is::
Why not allow Peterson to purchase and build a "small" resort development on the south end of the golf course on city land and then link it to Malan's Basin via gondola? The development would be privately funded and managed; therefore, it would create no risk for the city or its taxpayers. As part of the deal we could require no motorized vehicles be allowed or roads be developed on the property. Peterson could also continue to fund the development and preservation of our trails.
Peterson, on his own dime, could develop phase one of the project and that would allow the city and its residents the opportunity to see if the concept really attracts outside business investment and tourism to Ogden. If they could justify building the gondola from downtown to the university with hard data, then we could proceed at that time...
...Everyone knows we need more economic development in Ogden, but we don't want to sell our souls in the process. We also have to deal with reality and understand compromise is better than nothing...
To my knowledge, there is nothing to prevent Peterson from starting construction on a resort on his own property right now, which was, as we know, his original intent if he couldn't swap the property to his advantage. Nothing, that is, but the "necessity" of a "materiel moving gondola" to facilitate construction, acquisition of yet more property for a housing development to pay for the resort, and a commitment from Ogden City to invest millions in an "urban gondola." Of course, it could be that Peterson and investors do not currently have adequate funds to build the resort, or that it has been decided that a resort in Malan's Basin is simply a bad idea. Whatever the case, it is indeed unusual for a developer to demand that a municipality provide transportation access to a projected private development outside the boundaries of the municipality, isn't it?
Two things that have rarely been discussed in this project are:
If it is carried through with the current concept, it might, from previous experience in that area, take years and years to complete it. I think it took ten years to finally sell all the lots in the gated community on Darling Street that is adjacent to that property now, and the number of lots there is much less than the projected 400 Peterson is speaking of. If that project represents a realistic timeline for this project, and if the money from the projected sales from Peterson's houses is going to be used to finance the resort, this project, if it happens, may not even be completed for decades.
Secondly. I have read elsewhere that since Hurricane Katrina, construction costs have skyrocketed. That, coupled with the decline beginning to be seen in the housing market and the raise in interest rates, might make the construction and sale of these "footprint" homes no longer economically viable.
I have not seen these points addressed, and I think they should be. We have also not seen any hard figures except the $500 million one being bandied about, which, depending on whom one reads, either represents the initial investment or the value of the completed project. There's quite a difference between those two things, as we know.
Another question, this one regarding the "urban gondola"---How can it honestly be said that no tax dollars will be spent on this project? If the plan goes through, and the money from the land sale is put toward the "urban gondola," who picks up the overruns? Perhaps an investor will come forward and agree to do this so as to keep the promises made by the original concept true.
All in all, I like having Jorgenson's piece out there because, although I do not agree with offering Peterson "the south end of the golf course," still, Peterson addressing the offered compromise would clarify things somewhat. His point of view here would be interesting, indeed.
Jorgenson's piece can be read here:
Ogden's Option B--Compromise
Peterson doesn't have the dough to build the gondola period! Jorgensen's article is a good idea, but the flaw is that Chriss doesn't have access to this amount of money. Old Chriss' allowance from his wife is pretty big, but it aint on that scale.
His whole plan is based on leveraging the golf course to the banks, to build the houses, to build the gondola/resort! This esentially means that the tax payers of Ogden, via the golf course, are going to take all the risks associated with building this down town leg of the gondola. We are going to be the first ones in, and the last ones out of this stupid Ponzi Scheme. In fact we will not get out until we will lose any where from $50 million to $100 million dollars, and have the economy of Ogden set back 25 years.
It is basically a giant house of cards waiting to collapse. A disaster of monumental preportions being blindly pushed by an arrogant and egocentric mayor and his completely incompent "A" team. They have not had one single success in spite of spending more than $50 million in public money over the last six years. They are losers, yet because of their access to our tax money, they forge on without a care in the world.
Rudi I want to know who exactly is paying for the propaganda booth at the newgate mall which features a looping video of the mayor and all his cohorts touting this scheme!
I thought that out of work filmmaker from California who was here supposedly filming a documentary on small towns...Turns out he was making a pro-gondola propaGONDOLA video. Can someone look into this?
The weird film maker from California was here doing work for the City telivision station. He made a video to recruit Minority Firefighters, and Police officers, to air on the Godfrey propaganda telivision station.
It wouldnt surprise me if he didnt slip in a few other projects for his lordshit.
Dian:
Rudi posted Kent's Option B piece on this website a while ago. That may be where you recall it from. The Standard Examiner ran it, but only in the on-line "darts and flowers" section, not in the print edition.
On the Newgate Mall gondola kiosk:
So long as the Lift Ogden or some other private entity is paying the kiosk space rent to Newgate Mall, and the promotional video was not made at taxpayers' expense, I see no problem with it all from an ethical POV. Except of course for the fact that it continues, as is Lift Ogden's wont, to present speculation as fact.
However, I have heard it said that Hizzonah directed the Ogden Dept of Public Works to send a truck... city truck, city driver, on city time --- out of state [to Wyoming I think] to fetch the "sample" gondola back to Ogden. Now that, I do have a problem with. Be interesting to know if that rumor is true. At the moment, it's merely rumor.
If, and when, the City Council approves the gondola scheme, it will then have become Ogden City policy and an Ogden City program. At that point, it would be quite proper to spend city funds to promote it, to educate citizens about it, etc. However, until that point, it is a proposal by the mayor and a speculative real estate plan by an out of town invester, and no more. Using city funds to promote that in a partisan way, prior to Council approval, is not ethical conduct on the mayor's part.
It would be appropriate for the city-owned cable station to run a public affairs program on which both advocates and opponents of the plan appeared to discuss the matter or answer questions. But using the city-owned cable station as an exclusive outlet for pro-gondola propaganda and for proponents of the Mt. Ogden Park Golf Course sale and Malan's Basin development to peddle their schemes is, on the Mayor's part, again, unethical conduct.
So Curmudgeon, what's new about the Mayor conducting himself unethically? He has been doing it steadily for the last four years that I have been observing him! I think he is confusing his city duties to church duties wherein it has been OK in the past to "lie for the lord".
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