Rolling out our new "Godfrey Dog & Pony Show" mp3 audio collection
We commented last week on the subject of Emerald City's recently compiled "wish list," wherein the city council reportedly enumerated a list of $43.2 million in capital improvements, to be prioritized over the next five years. Having reviewed the list at the time of publication of the above article, we queried whether the council may have "forgotten" about our dilapidated water and sewer systems -- systems which need $138 million in repairs to bring them up to snuff.
This morning's Standard-Examiner editorial follows up on the subject, with some new information from from Emerald City CAO John Patterson. Emerald City has planned for the expenditure of approximately "$7.2 million worth of rehabilitation between now and 2012," The Std-Ex reports. A mere "drop in the bucket," the Std-Ex calls it. Like the Std-Ex editors, we wonder whether the $7.2 million, over a five-year period, is nearly enough. It sounds like a band-aid solution to us.
And the Std-Ex letters section features yet another Boss Godfrey rah-rah letter from the Boss Godfrey Campaign Letter Mill this morning, in which declared Emerald City resident and apparent Godfrey-lemming Jean H. Mathews complains that "other people" are ill-informed. Judging from Ms. Matthews' letter, it would appear that there remains at least a rear-guard of a few people residing in our Brave New MattGodfreyWorld who still cling to the now-thoroughly discredited notion that it's Chris Peterson's own money (and not our Mt. Ogden Park equity) which Chris "plans" to "invest" in our town -- and that Boss Godfrey has the lumpencitizens' best interests at heart. Godfrey is "aggressive and single minded," Ms. Matthews readily concedes. "Aggressive and single minded" -- like a swarm of killer bees -- we ever so snarkily intone.
And last but not least, we're going to reprise a discussion we had earlier on these Weber County Forum pages, in which one of our gentle readers highlighted an April 16 question & answer session at Weber State U.
Whereas we'd earlier posted a written transcript of that entire proceeding, we're now going to one-up ourselves, with some new material furnished over the weekend by another gentle reader. In that connection we've uploaded a series of mp3 audio files to our archive storage site, which are helpfully indexed at this link. We have a full audio transcript, along with some carefully selected audio excerpts and text files. Be sure to check it out.
The written transcript was revealing; but you ain't heard nuttin' yet -- until you hear it all delivered in the Alternately Snarling & Sniveling Boss Godfrey Munchkin Voice. We encourage you all to download these files to your iPods and play them back everywhere you go. Amaze your Friends! Experience endless gleeful hours of knee-slapping auditory pleasure!
We've also added a link to these files in the sidebar, entitled "Godfrey Dog & Pony Show."
Have at it, gentle readers.
What's on your minds this Monday morning... or later in the day, as the case may be?
© 2005 - 2014 Weber County Forum™ -- All Rights Reserved
82 comments:
Gotta tell ya, today's SE editorial is in the running for "Wimpy Editorial of the Month" honors. It reports that Ogden plans to deveote about a million and a half a year over the next five years to a problem the paper says requires $138 million to fix. Do those stark facts lead the SE to take a stand on the matter of sewer repairs, to demand that much more done to fix a major problem? Well, no. The SE editorail merely says the paper is happy that Ogden at last seems to be doing something about the problem, however little. The editorial ends up courageously, boldly, fearlessly concluding that "Ogden's leaders will have to make sure they spend taxpayer money wisely in order to make sure there's enough to do what's needed."
Wow. Stop the presses! Hot news out of Ogden! Standard Examiner calls for city to spend money wisely! Film at eleven!
What's next? A hard-hitting SE editorial courageously endorsing motherhood, apple pie, puppies, kittens, baby seals and the flag? Only days away, probably.
The SE editorial board seems to have forgotten that sometimes the phrase "hard-hitting" not only can, but should be appropriately attached to the word "editorial." You'd think in a Republican-leaning state, the spirit of William Allen White would still be alive and scrapping in the editorial offices of its daily newspapers. If the paper you had in mind was the Ogden SE, you'd be wrong.
For those who don't have time to read the whole transcript, here are a few interesting excerpts from the mayor's presentation at WSU:
On the WSU land study:
You know, I think that by no means is the door shut on Weber State land up above. Like I said, I don’t know how you can say for 50 years we didn’t need this land and then all of a sudden in the last three months it’s indispensable. I think there’s a lot of farce in all of that, in all that’s gone on in that whole study and that whole process. . . .
So, that’s why I say there’s really a lapse of academic integrity in this whole study, and what is really necessary and in the whole master planning that has gone on, how can you all of a sudden go 180° from not needing and not buildable to we gotta have it and there’s absolutely no way we can sell it, I mean, it just doesn’t make any sense, especially when you look at the projections.
On WSU Geology and Geography professors:
. . . a year ago there were professors here in the Geography and Geology departments who were saying, “It’s impossible to build on that hillside. It’s ridiculous that Chris Peterson’s proposing to build anything on there because I know, I’ve done research, and you can’t build on there.” And now all of a sudden now it is buildable. All of a sudden they had the DCFM come up and then the state guys said you can build on it and where’s the outcry now? Why aren’t those guys saying, “Wait a minute, it’s not buildable. I did research. I’ve done research and you can’t build on there.”
On the environmental impacts of the project:
. . . we actually did a study to see what kind of impact this would have and this has the ability, if 7 percent of skiers of today that were going to Snowbasin decided that they were going to use the gondola and go to this new resort, in some way or even ski back home from Snowbasin, if just 7 percent of the skiers did that, that would eliminate 28 thousand pounds of emissions from the environment from his area every year. So, that’s a significantly positive impact.
. . . it’s in Chris’ best interest to have it remain looking like a wilderness kind of area, while creating access to recreation and experience. So, he has, I think, the same incentives that environmentalist would have. I actually watched a debate between he and the president of the Sierra Club, who happens to teach here at Weber State, over environmental impacts, and it was fascinating. Chris Peterson is very in-tune with environment issues and concerns and mitigation. I mean, he had just great retorts to the concerns that were brought up about environmental impact.
On skiing conditions in Malan’s Basin:
This last year was the worst year in a long time and he went up and they actually had ski footage in mid-March. So, a month ago they had footage of skiing up in Malan’s Basin. Everybody’s says it’s the west side of the mountain, you can’t ski there, there’s no snow, but I mean, in the worst snow year we’ve had in a long time, in March when it was 70° down here, they shot some pretty incredible footage of snow up in Malan’s Basin. So, they do get pretty good snow. They will have to do snow making. They are planning on doing snow making up in Malan’s Basin just because that kind of helps insulate you from the weather a little bit.
On the Snowbasin connection:
Chris Peterson doesn’t have any arrangements with Snow Basin. They’ve made it perfectly clear that these are completely separate operations. They don’t have any part of this, and Chris is doing this on his own. So, the proposal is just to build Malan’s Basin and get it up into Malan’s Basin Resort. My personal belief is that they will connect at some point. You look at every other resort that are next to each other, it’s just a matter of time they connect. There’s just synergy in connecting resorts and making it all work together. I believe that will happen here as well, but that’s not what’s being proposed in this first stage.
On heating and cooling the gondola cabins:
In fact, if you ride them up at Snowbasin in the winter you’re taking off clothing by the time you get to the top. Even on a pretty cold day they actually stay pretty warm. In fact, many of the gondola cars end up opening the windows to keep some air circulating even in the winter. So, they stay moderate in the winter. In the summer months there are actually gondolas in very, very humid, hot climates. There’s one in Portugal, Japan, China, and in Columbia. You can actually build then so they have huge sections that can come out and create ventilation for the summer months so that you can have just wind that just rushes through the cabin in the summer.
On the impact to homeowners along the gondola route:
So, we actually got in a cherry picker and we went along the entire route and we videoed the route and we took pictures, kind of a 360° panoramic view along the way, to see how does this affect the neighborhood. We also met; we invited every homeowner in the entire corridor to come and meet with us and talk to them. . . . Very few people expressed concerns, especially after we passed around the pictures and said, “This is what it would do,” and they looked at them.
On the streetcar proposal:
Nope, the gondola would be the connection between commuter rail and campus, so otherwise there are no plans. The rail plans that they looked at between Weber State and 23rd and Wall are prohibitive. That means $100 million, and as much as taxpayers love you students, I do not think they are going to tax themselves. And the federal government would pay for about half that, so the community would only have to come up with the mere $50 million, and I don’t see them taxing themselves for $50 million to create a rail system between downtown and Weber State. I just don’t think that’s realistic. So, other than bus, I think the only hope for a transit connection between the intermodal hub, the commuter rail and Weber State, is the gondola . . .
On the time needed to complete the project:
His question is when do I anticipate this being completed and I’ve given up trying to answer that question because I’m always wrong. I’m really reliant on Chris Peterson bringing his proposal forward. I mean, the Urban Gondola would take about six months to do. The Mountain Gondola would probably take nine months to construct from the time you say, “go.” That would be the first part. The first thing that would happen would be the gondola being built, and so from the time it is approved and the proposal has to come out. I’m sure there’ll be a lot of public dialogue and debate about it, and then after approval you are talking six to nine months for the work to be done. That’s about the best time I can give you.
On property values and jobs created:
I do see us getting more upper-end because those are the kinds of jobs we’re bringing in. For some, that’s negative, it means property values will go up. If you own a home, that’s great news; if you’re looking to buy a home in ten years, that’s bad news. So, it’s all a matter of perspective and where you are in life, but overall it’s good for the community because it creates that rising tide. Even the people at the lower levels are positively impacted by more jobs. The result of this, we believe, will be another 3-5 thousand jobs over the next 5-10 years.
On the prospect of losing ski companies if the gondola is not built:
We have certainly the ability to lose many of these companies. We actually, Mike Dowse was recorded as saying, he is president of Solomon Atomic, the parent company, and Mike Dowse said, “Look, we have a ten year lease. We’re here. We believe in Ogden; we believe in the vision of what’s going on; but, if things don’t pan out in ten years we’ll be looking for a new home.”
On what would happen without Peterson:
Her question is, “What if Chris Peterson didn’t fund the project, where would the funding come from?” If Chris Peterson doesn’t do the project there isn’t a project.
Well, Dan, thanks for a good laff and some head scratching HUH's???
Still mangling the King's English. It's really embarrassing to read his mumbo jumbo. He's still touting a connection to Snow Basin as a possibility in the future.
This guy is so pathetic. Oh, wouldn't it be grand if a big Kansas tornado blew thru here and took the little jerk to another land of OZ? One from which there is no return and no magical red shoes?
In listening to the radio interview I heard at least 8 of Godfrey's trademark lies.
He implies that all of this building is outside investors putting their money in Ogden because of his efforts. No where does he tell "the other side of the story". That being the overwhelming majority of the money that is being spent is tax payer money that is being squandered on foolish nonsense like the gym and bowling alley, and against the wishes of the overwhelming majority of the citizens.
Although others here have, and will, point out the many "flexible truths" that pour from his mouth when ever he opens it. I will paraphrase one more from the radio interview that I think is representative of his natural dissembling nature, and which flow forth without any apparent awareness of the stupidity of what it is he is saying: The condo project at the mall is the first new condo project in Ogden in over a hundred years!
The Wizard of Oz indeed!
I am ashamed for Ogden to be represented by such a ninny.
To Jean Matthews and the rest of the blind followers:
The tax increases you mention have happened DURING Godfrey's term and were BECAUSE of his RDAs. Call the county or the School District and ask them. Godfrey’s financial dealings have placed both entities in financial distress. And the Godfrey-caused tax increases have not been slow as you say, they have been large.
How dare you accuse people like me of being misinformed when you and your ilk take no effort whatsoever to become informed?
And as far as tax increases, you ain’t seen nuthin’ yet. When Godfrey runs out of borrowed money to spend and pledge, then you will see the really big tax increases.
Hopefully, by then, you will begin to see the light.
And as far as Peterson goes, given the man has had 1.5 years to submit a proposal and from the Mayor’s own mouth still has not even a SCHEDULE for when he will provide a PROPOSAL, exactly what gives you the idea he has millions to spend on anything, or that he knows where to find his own elbow, for that matter? If you’d studied him a little, you’d find that most of his qualifications are simply untrue.
Now that the entire State education establishment has REJECTED his land grab, tell me, who do you find in support? Do you even know?
Dan, nice list of excerpts, I was wondering, why no comment. Is it lack of time or the fact that they're so ridiculus they don't merit comment? How,if I may inquire, ecologically sound was Mr. Peterson, and were any of his ecologically points germaine to what he may propose? I've heard from engineers that his first stab would have required the mountainside be stripped of all vegetation with massive excavation required, just for starters. Where would all this water for snow making come from? I personally don't feel this guy gives a hoot about ecology.
I hardly know where to begin in commenting on the mayor's remarkable statements. And I do have other things to do today. But here's a start:
One thing that continues to strike me about Mayor Godfrey is the way he continually sells Ogden short. WSU isn't on the map. The taxpayers will never support a streetcar. Ogden is in a downward spiral. The golf course isn't playable. Even if these things were true (and I don't think any of them are), isn't it the mayor's job to brag about Ogden, to tell people why they should invest and play and go to school here?
More later...
Ok, one more quick comment before I go to class. Has anyone else noticed what the mayor didn't say in his presentation? I couldn't find any mention of selling the golf course or other park lands in Ogden's foothills. He did mention moving the golf course, but not selling it. Amazing. The driving force behind the whole proposal is that Peterson wants to get his hands on 175 acres of prime city-owned real estate (plus the 130 acres owned by WSU). The mayor, who represents the city, talks for a whole hour but makes absolutely no mention of the city-owned park land that he wants to sell. Very, very impressive.
One other note on Mr. Peterson. Before he was suppressed from public speaking,(by the mayor and his new legal council, Ellis) Mr. peterson used to state on every occasion that he's been with Snow Basin for 15 years, Earl Holding hasn't even owned the resort that long. His brief employment their did however result in 2 very embarrassing episodes for the Holding family. The first when he puposely hid a plaque memorializing two skipatrolmen killed in an avalanche, and the second was mustering the whole crew into the SQUIRREL PATROL, this I believe led to his subsequent termination.
Don't be too hard on Jean H. Mathews (with one "t".
It is is obvious she is one of the thousands in Ogden who don't bother to research the facts about Ogden City government for themselves.
The ones who do not find out the facts for themselves are not entitled to throw stones at those who do.
I remember somebody compared Godfrey to Super Dell Schanze, the former owner of now defunct Totally Awesome computers. I used to love his commercials – love them because I knew the guy was a train wreck – and because I loved the fact that all his admirers would be soon getting their comeuppance – at least the ones who’d given him investment money.
Did anybody else notice how much more frenetic and loose Godfrey was at WSU than he was with Abby Bonnell? Was it because
1) Most of the time, like with Abby, he figures there are people listening who know the facts, so it takes him longer to construct his lies and he has to talk slower.
2) With the Weber students, he figured they were all in the dark, so he could run at full speed.
3) Or were there just some hotties in the front row?
I’ve spoken to him many times, and heard him, but it was fun to hear the real Matt in his unrestrained form, on the WSU tape.
I’ve known many “admired people” like Dell and Matt. Every one of them was a fast talker. Every one of them made it up as they went along. Every one of them had no concept of the truth. And every one of them crashed, taking other people with them.
There were so many lies in Godfrey’s WSU session that it is impossible to chronicle them all, and he sounded like he was high.
It would be fun if somebody could record Godfrey campaign headquarters on election night. That will be good.
Bill,
Please check your facts. Holding has owned Snowbasin since 1984.
I don't know how long Peterson worked there, but he was promoted to general manager when Grey Reynolds retired shortly after the Olympics, and lasted only a couple of years in that position. He certainly wasn't general manager "when the development [shortly before the Olympics] occurred," so I'm not sure what Godfrey was thinking when he says that Peterson was "running" Snowbasin at that time.
It's a minor detail, but amusing nonetheless, that Godfrey claims to have "watched a debate between [Peterson] and the president of the Sierra Club."
He's obviously referring to me: I was chair of the Ogden Sierra Club from 1999 through 2005. But I've never debated Chris Peterson. I did send Peterson a couple of emails in 2005-06, not about the project he was rumored to be proposing, but about what he had done already: the clearcuts in Malan's Basin and the climbing routes in Waterfall Canyon. I got only a single reply to the first email, and it addressed only about half of the points I had raised. Interestingly, in the reply, Peterson said he didn't want to get into a debate. Also, in the course of defending his clearcuts, he conceded that if he goes ahead and builds something in Malan's Basin, wildlife would suffer as a result.
I've never attempted to discuss or debate the environmental impacts of the proposed Peterson project in a comprehensive way. The impacts are so numerous and so massive that it's hard to know where to begin. The vehicle emissions from new residential traffic in the foothills would far outweigh any savings from fewer skiers driving to Snowbasin. The urban gondola wouldn't function well as mass transit and would preclude a more comprehensive transit solution in the downtown-WSU corridor. The loss of native vegetation and wildlife habitat in the foothills and Malan's Basin would be substantial. The stream in Malan's Basin and Waterfall Canyon would be polluted by runoff and by the wastewater from the proposed sewage treatment plant. There would probably have to be an access road built to Malan's Basin; this would destroy the natural character of either Taylor Canyon or Strong's Canyon, whichever route is used. The gondola itself would use quite a bit of electricity, and any structures in Malan's Basin would probably have to be electrically heated, which is very wasteful. There would, of course, be aesthetic impacts from the housing developments and gondolas. Some of these impacts can be lessened by being careful but they can't be eliminated and it's absurd for Godfrey to claim that the net environmental impact would be positive.
I hope that I am not naive here, I have come late to this site and perhaps it has been discussed before.
But, wasn't it part of the big plan with the Business Depot when it was given to the city by the US Govenment that the money generated there was to be used only for internal improvements at the base, and then after that only for Ogden City infastructure needs?
As I recall, there was a lot of discussion at that time about the deteriorating water, sewer and roads in Ogden, with most of them being 80 to 100 years old and much in need of repairs. The projected income from the Depot was going to be the panacea for these problems, wasn't it?
Can any one tell me if any of this money has been used for these purposes, and if so how much? Also, how much has been generated from the business park and where have these funds gone so far?
I too was surprised when I read the editorial about the very small amount of money allocated to this very large problem, and then to realize the blase' attitude the paper had toward the subject. Things like this give me a great deal of concern about the role of the Standard Examiner in the affairs of Ogden.
Wayne Peterson has also lagged behind his schedule for the reassembly of his faned Squirrel Patrol (Nuts! Get 'em), as his "land use team" is actually the same group of imaginary friends who tell him he's going to "invest" an imaginary "$500 million" in Ogden.
Here's some info,
this Gene Mathews lives in the same high rise on the top of 29th street, this is the same building that godfrey's grand parent-in-laws live, her husband also is the bishop in the ward where cliff goff was a stake pres over.
Big spread in the Sunday NY Times about TOD in Utah. No mention of any gondola though!
Rail Line Drives Utah Development
Southsider:
Nice catch. Thanks very much for the link. Transit Oriented Development has proven to be a winner time and time again, in large and mid-sized cities across the country. And the evidence suggests it will work as an investment generator in Ogden as well... if the Mayor ever abandons his pipe dream hobby horse tourist sky ride [aka "the gondola"] and begins, two years after he should have, to get behind a trolley line between downtown, WSU and McKay Dee as the WFRC study recommended. Don't hold your breath. Our Mayor is showing almost as well-developed an ability to ignore facts and evidence he finds inconvenient as his co-Republican executive in DC.
to marilyn -
You have it pretty well correct as to what was supposed to happen to the BDO and the income generated from it.
Income from BDO is now going to be used to pay off the debt on the Rec Center and grand new Junction complex.
Incredibly Boyer & Co. now has a 50-year deal for a big chunk of that income.
No fiction writer could have dreamed up the scenario for what is actually happening to Ogden thanks to Godfrey and his rubber stamp City/RDA Council.
thanks wccf:
Now we get the picture, we have a Mormon Bishop's wife coming up to bat for the former Bishop Godfrey.
Is it really true that Mormons believe Godfrey has been ordained by God? Or that all Bishops have been ordained by God?
I would sincerely like to know.
Question for wccf,
I am as curious now as uninformed gentile so I would like to know if it is approved for Bishop's wives to write letters to the Editor?
This dialogue is really getting interesting.
Just what are Mormon Bishops' wives allowed to do publicly so as not to reflect adversely on their husbands?
That question reads like it is a question about polygamist bishops but I am just talking about one Bishop and one wife.
I'm new to town.
Is the Stake President Goff a
Godfrey supporter, too?
Being a Bishop or LDS doesn't really have much to do with any of it. I'm also not sure that the little twerp is, or was, a Bishop. High Priest leader maybe, but Bishop?
Interestingly our lame Congressman is named "Bishop", he is a Republican of course. He beat out a Democrat who actually is an LDS Bishop! The race wasn't even close.
This Mathews woman is just a blind follower. Religion has nothing to do with it. I know her husband, He is actually a nice guy. She is nice herself, although as I said, not too bright.
That goes for the twerps Grandparents-in-law also, we all live in the same ward. Nice folks, although the wife was rather dim.
And being a Mormon myself, I can personally attest to the fact that a lot of us think the Mayor is incompetent, disingenuous and very bad news.
Every religion has its embarassing members. Matt Godfrey is our cross to bear I suppose. I can't speak for the people in his ward, but my guess is that he is not particularly well liked or respected there.
Said it before, will say it again. This dispute does not have a religious dimension. This is a contest between wise public policy, grounding on study and research, and wildly speculative public policy grounded on nothing but wishin' and hopin' and dreamin'....
On such issues, I imagine LDS folk, spouses included, are as free to opine and speak as anyone else. Sadly, some of them will do so [as will some non[LDS folk] without much examining the issues on which they choose to speak, but in the US, actually knowing something about what you are talking about has never been a requirement for actually talking about it.
Which, upon reflection, is as it should be in a free country.
Wish you could be as magnanimous when it comes to Republicans, Curm...many of your posts would be interesting all by themselves if you didn't feel the need to interject a snide remark, just 'cause you can, I suppose.
Only Godfrey thinks he is 'ordained' by God.
Sometimes I think God shudders too.
True:
Well, you need to consider two things, True. (a) it's election season [now through Nov] and (b) I am a member of the Weber County Democratic Party, which has what I think the advertising people call a "visibility" problem. Meaning it is, for most of the year outside of the month or two approaching an election, damn near invisible hereabouts. Dropping the occasional political reference in a post or two on WCF is part of my effort to rectify that in some small way.
I need not point out that your party does not have the same visibility problem in N. Utah.
Besides, reminding Rudi and Sharon that Hizzonah is a Republican is just too much fun to give up.... [grin].
If this is the same Jean Mathews that lives in the Sky Line Tower, then I also know her and her husband John. It has been several years since I have seen them. Last time I believe they were heading off to a mission in the East.
They indeed are nice genuine people. It is a little disappointing however to think that they believe Chris Peterson is talking about investing his own millions in the gondola. Millions that a lot of reasonable people doubt that he has by the way.
It has been made very clear by Peterson, the mayor and the whole Gonolista movement that is not the case. Their (non) proposal is that they plan to sell off the publicly owned Golf Course and use the proceeds to build the Urban Gondola. Then Peterson is to develope the land to raise the money to built the resort and up mountain gondola. In other words, it is the public's assets that are to be put at risk, not Peterson's, or the Mayor's. It is the public tax payers that will lose the $50 million AND the Golf Course if this very unrealistic and risky project fails.
So that leaves two possibilities with Mrs. Mathews. Either she does not understand just what is being proposed, or she is being intentionally dishonest like the rest of the Gondolista's have been all along.
I choose to believe that she just doesn't know what is really going on. She and her husband do not strike me as the kind of people who would participate in the big lie game that the Mayor so readily engages in.
And Curmudgeon, I hate to disillusion you, but this subject does have an underlying religious dimension in that a great deal of our LDS culture is "grounded on nothing but wishin' and hopin' and dreamin', and I'm not talking about the theology thing either, but in our ability to suspend rational thinking when it comes to believing leaders. This is why Utah is the stock fraud capital of the world, and why Bush is still supported here!
We believe that the leaders are ordained by God, and God don't appoint turkeys to leadership positions. If it were not for this we wouldn't have such a laughing stock for a legislature!
Please correct me if wrong, but was not Godfrey a LDS Bishop at the time of his re-election 3 years ago. I seem to remember someone saying that at the time.
--Waterboy
Oz: If it's even true that hopin' and dreamin' is more prevalent among the LDS, then it ain't by much. Wishful thinking is a universal human tendency. Part of growing up is realizing that we can't make something true merely by wishing it.
Unfortunately, our political/media culture encourages a closely related fallacy: The media too often repeat whatever elected officials say as if it were fact. After a while, the officials start believing they can make something true merely by saying it.
Back to the transcript of Elder Godfrey's delusional gondola gab-fest at WSU, someone remarked that in the audio Godfrey sounded "high." And how! He appears to be taking his cues hook, line and sinker from the Bush playbook. In the face of overwhelming, common-sense opposition to the idiot gondola scheme, Elder Godfrey is calling the state regents' edict "a lot of farce." To me this is of a piece with "Gonzales has my increased confidence" or "Heckuva Job, Brownie," or "the Iraqi people want us to be there."
Well, after all, Bush is the leader of Elder Godfrey's party.
(And as Stephen Sondheim says, "Don't you love farce?")
I wish Elder Godfrey were sufficiently important to attract the scrutiny of a pundit like Maureen Dowd. Can you imagine the evisceration she would serve up in response to the WSU harangue?
I found a lot to laugh at with the Godfrey Q&A at WSU, and in the radio interview.
A lot of dishonesty showing in both.
I suppose we could all have a great time for days picking out the little lies and inconsistencies in them.
For instance, in the radio interview the Mayor kept referring to the Gondola as if it were already built, in place and contributing to the growth of Ogden.
On the religious question, I would like to point out that Mayorial Candidate Hansen is a former Bishop in the LDS Church. Perhaps the rarest of all breeds, a Democrat Mormon Bishop!
Sister LaRue: Let us not forget that "Democrat Mormon Bishop" also applies to the scrupulously honest Stuart Reid.
Your vision of a "scrupulously" honest Stuart Reid is certainly not my vision,
The LDS (Mormon) Church has these policies:
1. Members should be politically involved.
2. Members may not use church property for political purposes, or infer the church supports a given candidate or cause.
3. Members should elect leaders who are both wise and honest, and who most closely reflect that member’s view of the proper role of government.
These seem like reasonable guidelines for anybody.
In the past, the church did recommend politicians and political party, sometimes changing those recommendations abruptly. Lately, the church has taken a position in rare cases. Some that come to mind are:
1. The church opposed the Carter Administration’s plan to spend billions to put MX missiles in underground railroad tunnels in the west desert.
2. The church opposes legalizing gay marriage whenever it comes up.
Then there are the RUMORS – that may or may not be true.
1. The church opposes birth control
2. The church opposes abortion
3. The church opposes term limits
4. The church opposes euthanasia
5. The church supports drug prohibition
And President Hinckley did say in conference that he supported going after our enemies when the US invaded I think, Afghanistan (or maybe Iraq.) But I haven’t heard any support for the ongoing effort there. Of course, this was his opinion, not church policy. After all, leaders of the church are men and women who have opinions. Not everything they say is supposed to be taken as the word of God, although some incorrectly take it that way. Worse, some try to imagine what church leaders are thinking, instead of simply using the brains God gave them to think for themselves.
When a person infers church support for a given political cause, as Godfrey does for some of his dealings, it’s kind of a give away, since they are violating church policy to say that. If somebody claims to have church support, ask to see a letter from the first presidency. If they can’t produce one, then write a letter to Salt Lake yourself, and bust them.
As far as Godfrey having been a bishop, I would offer that the Matt Godfrey of 1999 would not have recognized the Matt Godfrey of 2007. He has changed. The last time I saw him was at a Stake party in Mt. Ogden Park. Most of the time, famous people and politicians attract a crowd. He attracted none. I said to the people I was with, “That guy is the mayor of Ogden.” They replied, “You’re kidding.” If anything, people were avoiding him.
There are local church leaders who support Godfrey, and who have the same right as any of us to have an opinion. But I see no evidence that he is being secretly backed by the church or even that he has much support among its members.
As long as somebody is honest and at least trying to be wise, I don’t really mind them being a liftie or a smarty, a Johnny Lib or a right-winger, a Repubo or a Demo. We can work it out. The problem for me is Godfrey seems neither wise nor honest.
That’s my take. Blah blah blah.
Danny, could not have said it better meself.
Democrats in Weber County have, in the the past, I suspect, made an effort to find candidates who have been active LDS leaders locally in hopes of defanging the [false but seemingly popular local] image of Democrats as a strange and scarey [meaning not PLU --- people like us] breed. [E.g. Dave Thomas, congressional candidate a couple of elections ago.]
That was, I think, a mistaken tactic. Selecting candidates because of their religious affiliations almost always is. So is avoiding selecting a candidate for the same reason. [Note: Mr. Thomas and others may have been, and I think myself, were very qualified candidates --- and certainly were more so than the Bushie sock-puppet we have representing Ogden in Congress now; nevertheless, I suspect more weight was given to their religious affiliations in hopes of appealing to presumed-to-be-conservative LDS voters than should have been.]
But, to round on my own party for a moment [which I do frequently in other venues], that tactic bespeaks a greater strategic mistake: trying to make Democrats in Weber County seem to be practically, nearly, almost kinda-sorta like Republicans, except maybe just a little bit around the edges. There's a formula for defeat if ever I heard one, for a minority party.
Democrats... even relatively conservative ones... are still well within the liberal tradition [e.g. like myself, New Deal liberals], a tradition that poll after poll suggest is still enthusiastically embraced by the great majority of the American people. [Witness e.g. G. Bush's attempts to "rally" the nation behind privatizing Social Security.]
A minority party... particularly Democrats... should not be going around saying "we think so too" with a wet finger in the air to catch every presumed shift in momentary public opinion prompted by Sean Hannity's latest dyspeptic rant on the tube. Minority parties make gains by being different than the majority party, by standing for, advocating --- loudly --- change. They have to stand for something --- and something substantively different than whatever the majority party stands for. Why elect a warmed over pseudo- Republican who calls himself a Democrat when you can elect instead the real thing? [An obvious truth the DLC seems still not to have grasped.]
In conversations with my fellow party members hereabouts, I occasionally get lectured on how conservative people are in N. Utah and how we, as Democrats have to take that into account when choosing candidates and taking stands on public issues. To which I invariably reply: "And how's that been workin' for ya?"
To hell with that. It's a clearly losing strategy. Democrats ought to be Democrats and stand for something different. They ought to be saying what they think is right --- for Ogden City, for Weber County, for the State of Utah, for the USA --- and not be looking around for what they think it might be safe to say this time round.
May well lose elections that way, but hell, we're losing them now anyway. One of the things successful parties do is educate the voters over time, to bring them around to the party's POV. It's called leadership. We ought to try it as a party in N. Utah sometime. How many times do we have to have it illustrated for us that doing what's right, advocating what's right, is in the long run the best politics? Always.
"Play it safe" can be an effective strategy when you are a majority and trying to continue being one. It's an absolutely guaranteed loser as a strategy for converting a minority party into a majority one.
Danny:
Well put. Most churches engage politically when their religious beliefs are directly involved [e.g the Catholic Church on abortion for example]. But no particular religious principles seem to be involved in the Tourist Sky Ride the Mayor wants to build by selling Ogden's largest park. As you note, I don't know of an LDS [or Catholic or Protestant or Jewish or Moslem or Wiccan or Druid] position on the Sky Ride.
Curm: Sad, yes, but it was not always thus. When I, still wet behind the ears, stumbled wide-eyed off the Greyhound in Salt Lake, an assistant attorney general told me that since I was from Weber County, he ASSUMED I was Democrat. (He was wrong. That was before I knew the facts of life.) Ah, for those days!
I don't think you can truly consider Stuart Reid a democrat. He was (correct me if I am wrong) a republican when he ran against Rocky in SLC many years ago. I think he only coined the democrat moniker because Jon Greiner was already the republican running for the same office. Kind of like choosing the thimble in Monopoly. You dont really want it, but the car and top hat have already been taken, and the iron is the only other choice available....
--Waterboy
I don't know what religion has to do w/ the gondola. But isn't the reason why the Church (or any church for that matter) remains neutral on politics is because they could put their tax exempt status at risk if they choose to take sides on issues? Remember the big flack the LDS Church received a few months ago after some leaders had a meeting w/ Mitt Romney? Much ado about nothing. Fact is, Republicans are seen as the party who are defenders and promote "family values" (which is totally bogus) thus most Mormons in Utah will flock to that party no matter what (sheepishly).
Fact is, Republicans are ultimately Democrats who don't know what the hell is going on.
I don't care whether Scrupulous Stu is truly a Democrat. I care only that he's virtuous, lovely, praiseworthy, and of good report.
Moroni
Scrupulous Stu is a real gas when he is all dolled up in his/her biker drag and canoodling with Matt who's in his macho biker leathers, in the head in Angelo's on 25th. What a sight! Two ex-bishops in biker drag entwined and in a serious discussion of the scriptures, no doubt!
When SS ran for mayor in SLC against Ogden's own embarrassment Rocky Anderson he was neither Demo or Repub as that race, like Ogden's, is non-partisan. But it really doesn't matter anyway, not in Utah. Both parties are pretty much corrupt, and neither one truly represents the people, only their party leaders.
Which reminds me, what's with these carpet bagging mayors anyway? Macho Matt is from Harrisville and Rocky is from Ogden.
And finally, if anyone thinks just cause the LDS church doesn't make public pronouncements about issues that they are not involved in them, is definately naive. There is nothing in Utah politics that the church does not influence one way or another. And anything President Hinckley says is church policy. He is not only a very wise man, but he is also a master at PR. He spent his whole working life as a PR specialist for the Church. He fully recognizes the power of his pronouncements and he never abuses them. Still, when he speaks the whole church listens and acts accordingly.
I think the real tragedy with Mormon politicians is that most of them just parrot his words, but never really act according to his teachings.
Other than his flaky and 'off his rocker' father-in-law and family, WHO does really like Matty?
It would matter not if the jerk was unaffiliated with any party, he'd still be an embarrassment to the human race.
Power corrupts and absolute power corrutps absolutely. Godfrey is hell bent on absolute power, absolutely.
What I cannot understand is how some of his 'administration' can stand to be around him? Do they not have a sense of smell?
There must be some who like Matty. He was, after all, re-elected. And several people see fit to proclaim his greatness in letters to the editor to SE. Especially when they feel he has been treated poorly by someone else. Unfortunately.
Waterboy:
Exactly. Those who are hoping for a change in the Mayor's office come November should not under-estimate Godfrey. He has won the office twice. He is well funded and backed by well-heeled and influential people in [and out] of Ogden. He can to some extent dictate news coverage by [as Nixon's people put it] "maximizing the fact of our incumbancy." By timing announcements to do his campaign the most service.
Do not underestimate him as a campaigner.
Ohhh, Jesus, here's well-rounded and balanced Curmudgeon lecturing us all about Little Matty Gondola Godfrey's electoral prowess (although, I happily note, without the italics this time). Here's the thing, Champion of Balanced Rationality, Good Old(?) Curmudgeon: Ninety percent of the 3,200 votes Little Matty received in the last primary were drawn from the East Bench, well before his emergence as the world's biggest (smallest) dupe and jackass, self-important Gondola Godfrey that he now is. Of all these backers and financiers of which you speak, 80 percent cannot vote for the Ogden mayor's office. In fact, I'll bet that at least 2,000 of those Godfrey votes came from people who are now SGO supporters; they just didn't think his opponent was palatable as mayor at the time and they weren't acutely aware of Little Matty's numerous pathologies, chief among them being Little Lilliputian Matty thinking God told him to build an urban gondola and that his man-crush-potential-European-lover-traveling-pal-c-smoker Wayne Peterson would be the one to deliver us all unto said salvation. As I've stated previously -- and as many commenters have noted -- except for a small pack of rabid morons and lunatics (read: GTrain Wilkerson, Giegers [THE SKI IS BEAUTIFUL BLUE], Bernie Allen and Gondola Boy [jackass!] Mike Dowse, and relatives of relatives who write letters about the greatness of Gondola Godfrey) he does not have a good base at this time; he's alienated the voting public and most of these 114 real estate clowns who sing his tiny praises either cannot or will not vote. Another thing: Little Matty Gondola Godfrey and his henchmen inserted the LDS dimension into this problem by: A) Little Matty, in a staff meeting, told his subordinates that he was ordained by God to carry out his gondola mission and save Ogden; B) A former Marine captain used the LDS Church (43rd Ward) as a bully pulpit to scream at fellow worshippers in lunatic rants because they would not support gondola idiocy; C) Cliff Goff inserted himself into this mess, calling for civility as an LDS figurehead, even when he was one of the principal architects of the Mt. Ogden GC financing scheme that paid for Lorin Farr swimming pools, and the parking lots and tennis courts west of the GC. The bottom line is, Mr. Fair, that Gondola Godfrey is in no way invulnerable, but we need to brand him as Gondola Godfrey and never allow a voting soul to forget that Teeny-Weeny Matty Godfrey is willing -- and screaming! -- to give up 160 acres of prime, publicly owned real estate worth $100 million for pennies on the dollar to someone he traipsed hand in hand with throughout Europe in search of saviorian gondolas.
THE SKI IS BEAUTIFUL BLUE.
Speaking of Mormons,PBS through a joint effort between Frontline and American Experience will be airing a series, Mormons, begining April 30th. Given their reputation, this should not be fluff or unsubstantiated propaganda film. Given the dominance of this particular organization locally, this should be a must see, what ever side you come down on. In the preview there was a shot of Mitt Romney, so there could be a look into Mormon politics, no dout his candidacy has sparked national interests. Who knows, maybe they'll try to tackle how folks in Utah managed to suppress their own vote,requiring a super majority instead of a simple majority. I believe that partains to wildlife and land use initiatives. What a funny people we are, we don't even trust ourselves with our own democracy. In light of Godfrey being elected twice, maybe we should'nt.
Oh, and , nice summary Jason.
I've just come from the Council meeting! I'm livid.
I'd like to know where the rest of you were?
We on this blog go on tirelessly about Godfrey and his machinations, and yet the chamber was empty except for me, my husband, Curt Geiger, Rulon Yorgasen and a couple other people not affiliated with Staff.
You can read the agenda online, I suppose. Kudos were given to WSU's Men's Basketball Team...good job...and the Arts Council gave their overview.
Vice Chair Wicks let us all know that they WILL hire a water consultant! Kudos.
Then we went on to the ODOR ABATEMENT proposed ordinance. What an assinine bureaucratic jumble that is! The gist is that Patterson admitted this ordinance only addresses the dog food manufacturing plant. Other than the 9th floor, nothing else is stinking up the city.
Anyway, the gal who is apparently putting together the ordinance, Merrit Brown??, didn't really have anything concrete. Mostly, an 'odor officer' or someone would be empowered to place fines on the plant if the smells didn't stop.
This is so poorly conceived, I couldn't believe they actually considered this with Ms Brown by asking questions of her. Her answers were not well thought out, and she conceded here and there on points....what a mess. I was the only person to get up to speak.
I asked that the Council not approve. This company has been here for decades..and it is revenue producing (HELLOOOO), and since Patterson admitted that the plant rep said they'd install new scrubbers and were doing all they can to minimize and even eliminate the offending odors, that I thot the ordinance was out of line. Why treat this plant so punitively? We are not good neighbors to business by having this over-kill ordinance. It isn't necessary...and their 'odiferous officer' could work with the plant.
Then a couple on the council, guess who?, attempted to say that the ordinance would apply to other smelly businesses. Well, which ones? A bakery? Patterson told us in the beginning that this proposed , unwritten, unwieldy 'ordinance' only applied to the dog food company. Well, the vote was taken..ALL said 'yes', except Garcia. His no vote was becaue he said he didn't like putting fines on businesses.
Then Montgomery gave a power point infomercial on MU. If you didn't listen, you would have thot it only applied to the Riverfront Project and a few areas DOWNTOWN. We were assured many times that 'the Council has the authority to approve or disapprove ALL development requests coming before them'....Van Hooser, Wicks, and Stephens asked many questions. It was apparent that Stephens and Van Hooser, especially, were struggling to understand just what the heck Montgomery was telling them. REALLY trying to understand. Their questions were cogent. Amy had good questions too.
GODFREY INTERJECTED HIMSELF INTO THEIR DELIBERATIONS TO GIVE HIS TAKE ON THE ZONING PROCEDURES AND ASSURE THEM THAT 'NOTHING' CAN BE DONE WITHOUT THEIR APPROVAL'. Methinks he doth assure too much. (As we shall see).
Montgomery 'explained' that this needed to be approved by JUNE 4 !!! because there were River projects that must go forward. (Isn't that godfrey's MO...always in a rush? They've had over 4 years to get this thing done...why this push right now?
Well, Montgomery's last remarks were that we needed this ordinance passed now becaue 'a developer needs to have it done now'.
A query: "Is it appropriate to ask who this developer is?" Answer by Montgomery; "NO".
My turn. "That's the scariest thing I've heard all nite. You have a right to know who the developer is! It is your duty to ask!" I thanked the ones who asked questions for asking and attempting to learn. I implored them to study and ask more questions...the PC had tabled a couple times...since Dec...and I asked the Council to take their time. It was apparent to me by their questions, which I appreciated, that they all didn't understand what was before them...so study it out before voting.
Susie agreed and said she'd like to take the time...and made a motion to study, ask questions, ("even on a Saturday"), and her motion was seconded.
Guess what: GODFREY BEGAN TO PUSH THE COUNCIL TO VOTE NOW AND PASS THIS MU ORDINANCE BECAUSE IT WAS NEEDED AND THE COUNCIL STILL RETAINS THE FINAL SAY. I wanted to scream! It was not time for Administration and Staff comments. The Council was still in session deliberating!
Godfrey, IMHO, was WAAAY out of line. He had no business lobbying the Council to change their motion and vote this MU ordinance as presented!
I'd like one of you smart people to tell me if what he did was 'illegal' and unethical?
Who the *&^#$^&* does he think he is? Never mind...I know who he thinks he is.
Garcia was not about to acquiesce to Godfrey's nefarious whinings. I thot Jesse was pretty tuff for awhile. He said the Council was not comfortable with going forward and wanted to take their time and even set a date of July 12 to 'study'.
I'll be darned if, after Stephenson and Safsten chewing on how to change things, they decided to take a vote. Stephens' name was called first. He said, 'what are we voting on now?' Well, it wasn't Susie's original motion. It was now to extrapolate the part about the River Project and the June 4 deadline! Oh, and of course, they could meet on July 12 to study.
So, after agonizing, Stephens said 'yes'...everyone said 'yes', except Jeske. She said , "I'm not comfortable with this and I vote no".
So, Godfrey got his way.
How the *&%#@$%^&*& could Stephens, Van Hooser, and Garcia, AFTER wanting to take time, fall in with Godfrey?
Susie even said that she didn't like how everything was always a 'rush'.
Yet, when the mayor interjected himself into Council proceedings, WITHOUT INVITATION, and lobbied for them to pass that ordinance, not one of them seemed to think he was out of order! Shouldn't Jesse have banged the gavel??
It's so bloody frustrating to watch this council. Just when I think they are really deliberating and serving the people well, they seem to get lost and 'go along' the primrose path.
I appreciate their questions...they truly seemed to want answers. They just didn't hold out for common sense.
The mayor needs to be put in his place once and for all, and I really thot Jesse was gonna follow thru on that. They should not have voted for a mishmash punitive ordinance against the dog food manufacturing plant. That was wrong.
Ah well, that's the way it goes on Tuesday nights. Sure wish Dan, Bill, and all the rest of you who write so eloquently, and otherwise, about the state of affairs in Ogden, had bothered to show up.
Here comes the Judge! Here comes the Judge! remeber that one on tv a while ago. it is just a few months away and then HERE COMES THE JUDGE!!!!!
Jason:
Two points. First, you wrote: Ohhh, Jesus, here's well-rounded and balanced Curmudgeon.... Champion of Balanced Rationality.... Well, I've never been called a "champion of balanced rationality" before, but I rather like it. [I have been called a great many other things not nearly so complimentary over the years.] Thanks.
As for my caution not to take Mr. Godfrey lightly in the coming election: I am now officially according to the Great State Of Utah, an old guy [I get into state parks at half price]. In the course of all those years, being a somewhat partisan political activist in four states, I've seen elections lost by over-confidence, and by underestimating the opposition, particularly incumbent opposition.
You seem to have convinced yourself that Hizzonah is toast, electorally speaking. I hope you are right. But one of the surest ways I know of to disappoint that hope is to assume it cannot help but be true and to campaign accordingly.
The other thing to point out is that Hizzonah is reported to be well-funded for this race... so well funded that he has enough left over to financially support a council candidate or two in the election as well. As you may have noticed, money is a not inconsiderable factor in the outcome of many elections. I suspect Hizzonah will go into the final campaign [post primary] with a war chest at least twice the size, and possibly three times or more that of his opponent. Maybe your experience is differnt, but mine tells me that ignoring that kind of financial edge in a local election is, as a rule, foolhardy. However warm and glowy it makes you feel to dismiss his supporters as "a small pack of rabid morons and lunatics," that's not a wise way to approach the opposition in an election.
Maybe you've seen polls on the Hizzonah's support among likely voters. I haven't.
I hope he will not be re-elected. I am working to that end, as I am able. But I am convinced it would be a mistake to under-estimate a well-funded two time victor and incumbent in what has been historically a low turnout race.
Bill,
If anyone wants to know aobut the Mormons....why not go to them and get firsthand knowlege?
I wouldn't trust PBS to know the truth.
General Conference was just broadcast on KSL (locally) on March 31 and April 1. Anyone culd have watched.
The next General Conference will be the first weekend in October. Everyone is welcome to listen.
All wards welcome vistors each Sunday.
You want to know what Mormons beleive? Go to the source.
Stop those well dressed handsome young missionaries and ask them!
However, don't ask Godfrey....his actions tell us just why so many people think Mormons aren't very good people.
Sharon:
I am glad you and Rulon and a handful of others have the time and inclination to devote to regular attendence at Council Meetings. Not everyone does. Which is yet another reason the Council should act, swiftly, to have tapes of the Council meetings aired several times on Channel 17 during the week following every meeting, so that what transpires, and who said what in the course of the discussion, can be more widely known by the citizenry.
Sharon,
Thank you for the report on the Council meeting. I'm sorry I couldn't be there. Am I to understand that the Council passed the MU ordinance in the form recommended by the Planning Commission? That would be a mess.
Dan, I just got off the phone with Sharon. She's unclear about whether the council passed the entire proposed mixed-use oridinance, or only an ordinance or resolution making it applicable to the River project.
Obviously we need some clarification on this.
Well, Curm, I don't know what kept you busy and away from the Council meeting tonight, but if you ever attend, you can get up and SAY to the council what you've just said here!
BTW...I have said that at the podium many times. For all the good it ever does.
I reminded the Council tonight that I'd asked two questions of them last time:
"What is the status of Peterson's lease/option on the Wall Ave property? Do you know? Pls tell me. If you don't know. Then find out, and let me know".
Two:
"Which retail are coming into the Junction? Do you know? Please tell me. If you don't know, please find out and let me know".
Dead zone eyes. No questions asked of the Council are ever answered. Anyone else ever notice that?
If I'd had more than 3 minutes, I wanted to discuss the Ch 17 monopoly. Castro has had nothing on Godfrey's coup and overthrow of our airwave.
How about his 'call-in show'? He doesn't take calls! Yet, the number is emblazoned on the screen while he has Doug Jardine adroitly lead him thru his PR paces.
November cannot come fast enuf for me.
Dan....after the mumbo jumbo that went on...and Susie's original motion to set it all aside and 'study'...the bloody thing was hashed about and the final version SEEMED to be, that to accommodate ' an UNnamed developer by June 4...the portion of the MU ordinance would be passed that would allow some development on the Riverfront Project.
Stephens had to ask, "what are we voting on now?" when the roll call vote came because the damn thing had been tweaked and mucked about and LOBBIED for by Godfrey! If he wanted it so badly that he interjected himself into council deliberations and forcefully lobbied...then all kinds of red flags and gut feelings should have told the entire council to vote no!!!
What a mess, indeed.
Perhaps Jeske will get on here and give us her interpretation...as she gave the only dissenting vote.
I reminded the council that they are the legislative body and it is their duty to KNOW who the developer is (NO ONE ASKED!)...and to understand the MU ordinance as presented. After all, the PC took months to deliberate.
If I was a drinkin' woman, I'd have a triple rootbeer, on the rocks!
Dear Mr. Get it right, I have been exposed for many years and have learned over the course of time not to accept blindly what someone says about one's self. (Godfrey would be a good example) As for trusting PBS, despite all the BS spewed on rightwing talk radio, the news related programing on PBS is much more accurate and in depth than any of the comercial networks, and I would dare say Frontline is far above anything the other networks offer in single issue story coverage. No disrespect but, we waited almost 150 years before the mormons even acknowledged any complicity at Mountain Meadows, and even you must admit there is a great reluctance to allow academic exploration into thier history, even by members of thier own institutions. Just out of curiosity this program should grab your interest.
Thanks again, Sharon. Perhaps in the morning someone can explain exactly what the Council passed. I'd sure like to see the actual text.
Dan, it's morning, sort of, the council website describes the action as follows, Amended Title 15 ,adopting new chapter 39,applicable to Mixed use zoning. Amended- to return on May 1st. agenda for adoption on common consent. Don't know if that helps, but if it's real bad we have a week to be heard. Can't recall ever having witnessed a failed common consent.
bill c. I could not agree with you more about the Frontline episode. I have to say I am very interested to see the show. It will also be curious to see if KBYU airs it if it has even the slightest rub against the LDS Church. If there is a rub against them I wonder how they will try to spin that...
Dear Jason:
Can you document your statement that Elder Godfrey asserted in a public meeting that he was "ordained by God" to oversee the installation of his gondola? That would be a most interesting (and useful) fact, if true. Many thanks.
Dear Moroni:
Someone should ask Little Matty Gondola Godfrey about his "vision" for Ogden, its divine origin, and whether he used the exact words "called" and "Heavenly Father" in staff meetings in the public works division several times in 2005. Methinks the LDS higher-ups would be none too pleased, although poor, insecure Little Matty would just deny it, then waste public time and money scurrying about trying to find the source, much like he did by ordering his Gestapo to round up employee mug shots because someone cursed him and his silly-ass gondola on city property, and his snitch thought it might be someone on Ogden's payroll. Also, I've got nuthin' but love for the Mormons, except for that whole BYU thing.
The SE has a story, by Scott Schwebke, up in this morning's edition, [inside pages of the Top of Utah section.] The story is pretty good, I think. [Read it all the way to the end for the full effect.] Link here.
I might... in fact, I would... question the SE's news judgment in going with a story on the Sniff Patrol on the front page of the TOU section, and relegating the MU ordinance story to an inside page. But the story itself seems to me to have been well done.
Are there any employees or ex-employees brave enough to make notarized statements about what they've heard the 'ordained one' utter about his visions?
This man is obviously delusional. I think he really does beleive in his supernatural powers, and not only that, but some of his family members also think THEY are 'called of God' to call the rabble to repentance.
In this unholy kingdom of theirs, no one should be speaking against the 'ordained one' as he pontificates from his throne.
So, all you who hint so broadly at these utterances should come forward. Nothing a mayoral candidate would say will be as powerful as those sworn affidavits...words from the holier than thou!
One problem with coming forward against the Mayor is that when he thinks he has been offended or has been challenged by his "underlings" (aka city employees) they are forced to Apologize to him personally. He does not like to be questioned by his underlings. I think that is why he has not held his city-wide annual "meeting with the mayor" for ALL city employees for over 18 months. Someone questioned the Mayor's plan or something and it was apparently more than Matty could handle...
Damn the employees for having brains and the ability to see right from wrong when it come to the Mayor
I walked out with Scott after the meeting last nite. He was rushing for his deadline.
I implored him to tell about Godfrey's hostage taking at the meeting. He just pushed past us.
I will say, Scott, that I'm pleased that you DID say that this MU zoning and Peterson (and his atty) go hand in hand.
I'm still in a state of shcok over the Council's cave to the mayor's FRENETIC LOBBYING during the Council's deliberations!
Come on, Jeske, Van Hooser, or someone with integrity.....is that kosher?
I thought the mayor had NO right to interrrupt the Council and argue for the passage of his pet ordinance! Why the heck HAVE a legislative body SEPARATE from the Administration if he is permitted to hijack the legislative body's deliberations for his own purposes?
It was appalling to witness. And, it was more appalling that this Council rolled over and gave it up without a shot being fired.
Thank you, Dorrene, for voting NO. Please, Van Hooser, Stephens, Wicks and Garcia. Go get a spinal infusion of iron.
I thought y'all were really on the right track last nite. But, as you were steaming into the station, you were derailed. That little pebble who thinks he's a Mountain Man....laid across the tracks and almost all of you veered off.
You can rectify this. Just come back and rescind your 6 to 1 vote! I think you know, today, that what you did last nite was play right into the hands of this 'do it NOW' temper tantrum cold little dictator. Just the fact that he nearly frothed at the mouth pushing for you to 'do it his way' should have stiffened your spines and given you the strength to do what is right!
He overruled YOU! The gavel should have come down heavily..."You are out of order, Mr. Mayor!".
I thot Jesse was going to do that..but then Safsten and Stephenson did the mayor's bidding...finally remembering their lines and roles, and the whole stand for common sense fell apart.
So, Council. Be united, please. You know this whole MU crap was written by Ellison. He came to your work meeting ( I heard him)... and the PC tweaked it, barely, and sent it on.
The only thing the mayor said that was true, is that the PC only recommends. SO? You were elected to think, study it out in your own minds, ask questions. If you don't think Montgomery gives you the correct answers, then, by gosh, bring in your own 'experts' on these matters. Peterson did!
Thank you for going ahead and hiring the consultant who will take a hard look at what lies beneath our city. Godfrey's disengenuous 'I want to save the taxpayers' money' regarding the consultant's fees is his attempt to keep a real pro from seeing the mess we really have!
Did Wicks ever get a full accounting of what this visionary has spent on his gondola madness? Videos, trips, trade shows, trip to DC, pamphlets, 'stuffers' for the water bills, a gondola display here and there, and on and on?
Of course, his sycophant Curt will no doubt step forward and tell us HE paid for everything. Wow! The mitten and scarf trade must be booming in this recreation hub of Amreica.
Who is the special mystery guest slated to make an appearance this weekend at the poorly named OTown "climbfest"? Could it be none other than the savior of OTown via the grand larceny of our public land himself, Wayne Chase Peterson? Will he have his famed Squirrel Patrol with him? Nuts! Get 'em!
The only climbing this numb nuts does is climb on the backs of the taxpayers.
Sharon:
You asked whether it is illegal or unethical for the mayor to interject himself into City Council discussions.
The answer is found in state law 10-3-1219(2)(g), which states that the mayor shall:
"(g) attend all meetings of the council with the right to take part in all discussions and the responsibility to inform the council of the condition and needs of the municipality and make recommendations and freely give advice to the council, except that the mayor may not vote in council meetings;"
Thank you, Fact Checker.
That's disturbing to read. However, the forceful way the mayor interjected himself into the Council's business last nite, could have been interpreted as
voting'.
What a disgrace.
Interesting piece buried in today's Standard from Rocky Fluhart.
http://www.standard.net/live/opinion/topofutahvoices/102749/
It had the faint sound of his hat landing in the ring! Is this Rocky's first shot in the upcoming mayorial election?
Will he run?
Good guest commentary this morning by Rocky Fluhart, in the SE.
Check it out.
"Selling the golf course and open space for economic development is like burning books for education".
Succinct.
I was impressed by the Fluhart article.
And I am hard to impress.
The Fluhart piece is indeed excellent. Link here . Particularly good, and from someone who is in a position to know, pointing out that covering the city's hillside parklands with upscale vacation villas is not only not a way to promote growth and development in Ogden, it is a way to retard both.
Good too in asking the questions many of us have been asking about Hizzonah's wildly speculative trade-our-parklands-for-a-tourist-sky-ride for a while now. Particularly, Mr. Fluhart wants to know, what market study suggests that there is a demand for second home vacation properties in Ogden? Such properties, he argues, will continue to sell where they are selling now: in the Upper Ogden Valley, not in the city.
All around thoughtful piece and a chewy read.
Run Rocky Run!
We need you, Ogden needs you.
Rocky's piece was well written. However, it is unlikely he would run for mayor. Didn't he step down from his position at SLC because of health reasons? I assume those same reasons would keep him from running for mayor in Ogden. Although an unhealthy Rocky Fluhart would be a huge leap forward over a healthy whatever we have now.
In today's WSU Signpost there is an interesting letter concerning the Weber State Matt Godfrey Dog and Pony "Debate". The writer explains that he had agreed to present an opposing view and debate the Mayor. Then he was called at the last minute by the event organizers and told that they had decided to just let the Mayor speak for the full hour without opposition.
This differs from the picture Mayor Godfrey painted, doesn't it? Why am I not surprised?
The only thing that would surprise anyone about Godfrey is if the Pope decides to beatify him.
Well Who's surprised,
They could beatify the ugly little punk a lot quicker than they could beautify him! Beauty is only skin deep, but this dude's ugly goes clean to the bone.
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