By Rudizink
Once again "red-meat" news items trickle to a standstill this weekend in and around Emerald City, as always seems to be the circumstance during the waning weekends of August. Having this morning thoroughly searched local media sources in vain for some nutritional news morsel to satisfy our gentle readers' intellectual cravings, we once again turn to our gentle readers to set the tone, with this new weekend open thread. We confess that we do this with some trepidation, inasmuch as we already have a fairly robust discussion going under our previous article. By no means do we wish to cut that excellent Curt Geiger-inspired discussion short. Nevertheless, we believe that the ongoing discussion may be growing unwieldy now that 50+ comments have been registered, so we offer this fresh page-space now for our gentle readers' latest rants and ruminations.
What's on your minds this weekend, gentle readers? You may carry on the previous discussion here, or start up something entirely brand-new.
Your blogmeister will be out and about for the balance of the weekend, so we ask the last one here to please turn out the lights.
And a quick note to the moron troll who's been posting the now-deleted flames from his Sprint PCS mobile device: Rudi has duly recorded your IP address, and STRONGLY advizes that you read our WCF Comments Posting Policy... and behave yourself henceforth and forthwith.
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53 comments:
Where do the Beus Drive gang and the Geigers go for a fine meal within Ogden City limits? I'd like their recommendations. Or do they drive to Layton to eat out?
The Geigers go to the world class and internationaly famous Red Rooster right here in Emerald City.
Yep, the very same place you are likely to run into some rich New York City Lawyer and his pretty trophy wife and two shiny college age kids who are going to Weber because of the Gondola and who vacation next door in their first class designer done condo right here in the resort at the bottom of the ski lift.
FREE MATT JONES
no no, Ozboy...they aren't here YET! They'll be arriving at the first fresh powder up there on Malan's Basin World Class Ski Resort!
But, they could be over at Descente picking up some new duds for the slopes...made in China and shown by young Bob himself!
Oz:
Yeah, well, I'm not wild about the owner's taste in city politicians, but the food's good at Roosters and the beer's good too. And the staff I've met are good folk as well. Or seem so. Not just yuppies who eat there, paisan.
We patronize most of the 25th Street eateries [though I can't get Mrs. Curmudgeon into a sushi joint with a crow bar]. We like the mix of locally-owned [non-chain] eateries like La Ferovia, The Athenian, The Bistro, Roosters, Union Grille. Haven't been to Peddlers yet, but will soon. Slowly working our way around some of the downtown off-25th outliers too, like [what is it? O-Jams?] on Washington, and Thai place or two. Overall, we think downtown has a nice mix of non-chain eateries. Sure as hell beats fighting the traffic to eat on Franchise Row in Layton.
Also like the Mexican restaurant in the clubhouse at Wolf Creek. Food's good, drink prices astonishingly reasonable and it is the ONLY place close by where you can eat with a spactacular view. [Note to renovaters of the Ben Lomand: damn it all, open up the rooftop grille and lounge. There is NO spactacular view dining in Ogden now. We have to go to the Upper Ogden Valley [historically, Ogden's Hole] for that. I know, I know, you have to put up with a lot of Republican golfers noshing down after a quick 18 holes, but no place is perfect.
To beat a drum I've beaten here before, Ogden does not take full advantage right now of what it has. How could you have the views Ogden has of the mountains and NOT have restaurants taking advantage of them? Tis a puzzlement to me and has been since I got here.
Stop Crony’s
Gary House should resign!! Weber County Commission needs to change the policy that protects big business over citizen’s health. Here is the article that was well written in the Standard Examiner.
As long as anyone can remember, the various county health departments in Utah have been called "public health" departments. It's not a proper title, but until Aug. 4 it was assumed to be a proper description of the departments' role in society: Taxpayers fund the health departments, which then endeavor to serve the health interests of the people living and working in their jurisdiction.
On the aforementioned date, the Standard-Examiner quoted Weber-Morgan Health Department Director Gary House in a story about E. coli infections attributable to meals served from an area restaurant. This newspaper wanted to know which restaurant was responsible for the infections, but House declined to provide that information.
Indeed, he uttered these astonishing words in defense of his decision to keep the identity of the restaurant confidential: "We have a policy not to disclose that information. Our policy is to protect businesses."
Come again? We had naively believed -- and we're sure we're not alone in this assumption -- that county health departments were there to protect county residents, not commercial enterprises.
But House was serious. The Weber-Morgan Health Department did not release the name of the restaurant -- Wendy's at 2594 N. 400 E. in North Ogden -- until days later, after the Standard-Examiner filed a request for open records via the Government Records Access and Management Act. The Utah Department of Health says county health departments get to decide what information to withhold from and release to the public.
How nonsensical. Despite House's warped view of his role, it is not to run interference for restaurants that have violated health codes and spread food-borne infections. Health departments are in place to protect individuals from, among other things, restaurants that sell food that makes people sick, or that have careless food-handling practices that pose a risk to public health.
This E. coli incident is especially instructive of the Weber-Morgan Health Department's folly, since two of the resulting infections -- the Wendy's catered a CORE Academy conference at Orion Junior High School in Harrisville -- resulted in hemolytic uremic syndrome, the most serious type of E. coli infection: It can destroy blood cells, damage the walls of blood vessels and cause kidney failure. If ever there was a need for the public to be notified, this was it.
In the wake of this mishandling of important public information -- House's effort to "protect" the offending business immediately cast suspicion on all Weber-Morgan restaurants that cater -- it's time for county health departments to take a pro-active role in disseminating public information regarding restaurant health inspections. The Davis County Board of Health has already been studying the issue of placing health inspection results on the county Web site. After its May meeting, we encouraged it to go forward with this public information program.
As we said then, and this applies especially to the Weber-Morgan Health Department: Public notification with all information is the best course of action. Health inspectors could make distinctions between "major" and "minor" infractions, with accompanying explanations, on the health departments' Web sites.
It could be easily done -- as it is in jurisdictions all around the country. Then, truly, the common term "public health department" would be fitting.
That’s what happens when you vote for Republicans!
They want less government. So you don’t know if a restaurant is a health threat?
They would rather protect their business buddies than the general public.
Free Matt Jones!
Monotreme:
Read notice of its opening, but have not been out there. The Ogden AP area is not someplace I normally find myself, what with the new helicopter pad just out past the polo pony stables here at home. Thanks for the pointer.
Wonder who coined the term "fern bar?" It catches so much with so few words. But for good food and good views, I can put up with a bamboo shoot or two. TY again.
Anyone care to nominate the best wine list in town?
The first time I heard the term "Fern Bar" was in San Fransico circa 1976. There were a couple there with the fern and jungle motif. The more famous one was called "Henry Africa"
Lots of pretty, almost pretty and semi rich or pretender folks cruisin the room eye balling each other! Lots of primpin and possin too!
Hell I even went into the head and fluffed up my hair and spritzed up with a little French stinkum for that little extra confidence boost.
Quite the deal actually. The drinks were pretty outrageous tho, as I recall a Scotch and Water was a buck seventy five, that's two bucks with a tip!
A longtime group of good restaurants include Ye Olde Lions Den, Rainbow Gardens and Maple Gardens for the best Chinese in Utah.
Comment banished by adminstrator to WCF Dungeon
omygawd...did you and chris visit rod on our dime like you did in europe???
no, i won't go there...too obvious.
Interestingly similar situation to ours in Marin County:
Historic use bumps into property rights
A fire road that runs through private property is at the center of a controversy between longtime users and new owners
'Consider adjourning into closed executive session to discuss pending litigation.' From the Ogden Council blurb in today's SE.
Hmmmmm? WHICH litigation would that be? Is Jones ready to go ?
Now the mayor has a cunundrum...he has to cram a third Peterson lackey down our collective throats IN A MONTH.., this one to replace Roanald Wheelwright on the PC. Mr. wheelwright is leaving for a career move to CO.
Janith in...Dustin on hold, and now LL will present yet a third name to the Council, according to the Scwebke article today.
Now, who among the mayor's comrades will he choose?
Wagers anyone?
The PC members understand its mission better than anyone else.
Are they allowed to present names from the community of persons they know to be experienced, unbiased, fact diggers, free thinkers,...in other words....fair, balanced, and able to decide on the issues without allegiance to or pressure from ANYONE???
Those of the gentle readers here who have been acquainted with the present members and their manner of operating have said the present PC...Janith hasn't proven herself...ARE fair, erudite and a hardworking lot.
Why couldn't they present names to the mayor?
One day, hopefully very soon, this assinine gondola/Peterson land grab will be gone. The Commission wil still have many issues before it. So for the mayor to so blatantly stack the PC with his sycophants is a dissevice to all the citizens and developers in future.
After the mayor's puppets attempt to give away our assets (emphasis your own)...what else will they know? One issue...no facts, no discernment needed.
Like a one-joke sitcom...doomed to fail.
All this talk of restaurants, etc. and Ogden not doing maybe all it could to promote what is already here or moments away has got me thinking.
Some steps in this direction already being taken. Recall Ogden hotels and city and UTA working on starting ski season bus service from downtown to the ski venues up canyon. That's a start.
Of course, we also have to note those in public positions who spend an inordinate amount of time running down Ogden's attractions. Like, oh, just for example, a mayor who can't seem to say often enough in front of reporters that Ogden's premier public golf course is unplayable and not golfer-friendly, etc. A wonder anyone shows up to tee off with the mayor running down that particular attraction every chance he gets.
But I digress. I'm wondering if it wouldn't be a good thing for Ogden to have a regular indy paper. A cross between, say, something like the now-dormant monthly [wasn't it called "The Street" or something similar?] that touted 25th Street attractions and carried occasional reviews and columns on the one hand, and SLC's The City Weekly on the other.
Its scope would have to be broader than just 25th Street. It would have to take as its subject the city. It could do yeoman service, I think, promoting the local arts offerings, like Utah Musical Theater shows, touring shows at the Peery's, the music scene at various venues, WSU performances, public events, gallery shows, etc. And, yes, restaurant reviews. [Yes, reviews.]
But to make it worth picking up and opening regularly, it should also include a strong and independent editorial voice, a commitment to a good investigative piece now and then, and opinion columns open to expressions on both sides of any issue the paper tackles. [To anticipate what I suspect is occurring at this moment to any Godfrey administration fans who may be reading this: no, I do not mean it should be an anti-Godfrey paper. Becoming that would kill it straight out of the gate, and insure a life, at best, no longer than the administration's.]
I know, I know, this is not SLC and the Ogden paper couldn't support itself by running a dozen pages of ads for "gentleman's clubs" in the back. And no, the city can't sustain a weekly publication of this sort. But the right mix of journalistic meat and entertainment, promotion and probing, might not only provide a little more life to Ogden journalism, it might also serve to promote city events. And publishing monthly year round might be doable.
I read the SE and one of the SL papers daily [usually the SL Trib], but I get nearly all of my information about what's going on in SL that I want to see or do there from the City Weekly I check its weekly events calendar instantly upon opening. [Yes, I know, the SE has one too, but it's bare bones "jes' the fact's, Ma'am" in its approach. The CW listings are written with some wit, and are entertaining to read even if I'm not interested in what's being touted.] The best guide to SLC theater IMO are the CW reviews, which avoid as a rule the "home cookin'" tone that's all too common in Deseret News reviews and the SL Trib's sometimes too. I learned the first year I was here to check the City Weekly reviews before shelling out for tix to Pioneer Theater, Salt Lake Acting Company, or Plan B Theater performances and driving down. And those reviews got us to shows I hadn't been considering seeing. Usually [ok, ok, not always, but usually] I was happy with the results.
Would it be useful for Ogden to have something similar? Would it go financially? I don't know. Just mulling over of a deliciously cool Sunday morning what Ogden might do, or people in it, to promote the city, and give those of us who live here a more lively journalism scene at the same time.
Link below is to post originally written by UTmorMan (Dustin Chapman,) and moved to Ogden Gondola blog:
The Anti-Gondola Tactic?
I believe the harshest and most useful criticism of those that critique the mayor are those that do not offer alternatives (If not the Rec. Center, what? If not the gondola, what? If not the Kemp Building, what? If not the Hampton Hotel, what? etc...)
This site would be the perfect place to offer names of thoughtful, objective folks who could serve on the Planning Commission.
Let's see them! Maybe some good names can come from it.
Curmudgeon,
Really like your thoughts on an indy newspaper. I think it very, very possible to do. In fact, it might be able to have a beneficial relationship with this blog and its writers.
I'd like to see that become a reality.
I've been thinking about this, and here are the names of some other people who are very fair minded, and would be ideal planning commission candidates:
*Ed Allen
*Bernie Allen
*Curt Geiger
*Bob Geiger
*Dave Hardman
*Larry Hansen
*Rupert Hitzig
*Gadi Lesham
*Chris Peterson
Like me, none of these people are biased in any way, and each of them would make a fine planning commissioner.
I forgot one: Rock Allen.
In fact anybody named Allen would be totally fair and honest, just like me.
Dustin Chapman:
You also for got three others. Godfrey’s mother-in-law, Godfrey’s Mother and also dogfrey’s wife...you know the ones that have been awarded mother of the year awards three years in a row. These people wouldn’t show any bias as well either.
P.S. If you think that Dogfrey is a typing error guess again...
The Ogden City Council meeting agenda as published one or two days before the meeting is pretty cryptic unless you're on the inside of city government and maybe not even then.
What about having a weekly column on the Ogden City website (fat chance!) or in the Standard Examiner containing a brief explanation of the background and importance of each item listed.
As it now stands, the citizens can't tell which items are legitimate requests and which represent someone trying to pull a fast one.
How about transparency in government or at least better investigative reporting?
Copperpenny, please reconsider your policy of not spending money in Ogden. Do you really think that your (and others) boycotting Ogden businesses hurts the Mayor? He seems to care about nothing but helping his buddies get rich and his personal, very fragile, ego.
All boycotts do is harm those independent businesspeople who are trying to make a living and who are doing something positive for our town. Rather than boycott local businesses, we should be going out of our way to patronize them.
Wouldn't it be great to be able to have data showing that Ogden is thriving despite the negative ad campaign Mayor Godfrey is running?
We have to put up with his abuse for 16 more months, but if businesses fail they'll be gone forever and it will be even harder to attract new ventures.
OgLover:
Couldn't agree more. We have a full time city employee, paid by the public, who is far too busy impairing the city's potential for smart and sustainable growth [his initials are MG in case you were wondering]to assist him in the process by trying to hurt existing Ogden businesses.
Though I have to admit, I avoid these days any business that displays on its business site a "Lift Ogden" sign. But other than that, we patronize Ogden business whenever possible. Saves on gas too and the aggravation of negotiating Riverdale or the Interstate.
The problem is, it's hard to buy some everyday items in central Ogden, even if you try. Hardware stores, for example, are pretty thin on the ground between WSU and downtown.
Our Mayor from Harrisville
Has conjured up quite a deal
He'll give away all public land
to a broke ass con man
Then the'll elope down to Brazil!
IT's LIMERICK TIME...LET"S SEE WHAT EVERYONE CAN COME UP WITH.
I can't wait to see OZBOY's!
Curm: Ogden DID have an independent monthly newspaper. It was called the Northern Utah Junction, and was published by Maury Grimm. Lasted a few years, then I think she ran out of money or energy or both. Seems like that was only three or four years ago but could've been longer. My impression was that it was very much a labor of love on her part.
I agree that it would be terrific to have such a paper again, and perhaps with all the get-involved attitude going around these days, it could be more successful. But anyone who's thinking of giving it a try oughta contact Maury first and get her advice. Anyone know where she went to?
There's two openings on the commission
All the clones are just hopin and wishin
just delete all your past
and cover your ass
And kissing butt is your admission!
Have you heard about my tram
It will take you clear to the Dam
Just give me your course
And without any remorse
I'll show you a hell of a sham!
Dan S.:
Thanks. I vaguely recall reading a few issues of something called The Junction when I first came to Ogden four years ago, but then it disappeared.
I have no idea if such would, on another go-round, be viable. I'd like to think that growth in Ogden, coming of the Frontrunner, improving business climate and expansion of existing businesses, etc. would provide a more robust environment for the effort. But I don't know. And I imagine if anyone had the wherewith all and gumption to give it [another] go, they'd be wise to follow your advice talk to those who tried earlier, and to indy publishers in similar sized cities for ideas on what works and what doesn't. I think indy publishers have an annual convention somewhere for shop talk, and for all I know, they have a trade association too. If so, the association publications [if they are like others'] are chock-a-block with start up advice, dos and don'ts, etc.
But I hereby state I am not now, nor have I ever been, a publisher and so have no clue whether it would work here now. But I thought it an interesting idea whose time, maybe, has come in Ogden? And besides, any community is better off for having two separate editorial voices speaking in print on public affairs rather than one. Really sad, and not in the public interest, that so many cities have lost their afternoon papers and so now are served [or serviced, if you want to get snarky about it] by only one regular paper and editorial voice.
Next time I win the Powerball lottery, I'll put starting up an Ogden indy on my to-do list....
Read Dustin's blog piece about us ANTI types. Am sure he was atempting to quote me and botched it.
The 'three years' makes me think t'was I.
What I said then, and have since is that if Peterson wants (and will) to build HIS gondola up HIS mountain with HIS money, then we will track how many tourists jump off I-15 to ride the thing to Malan's. We track all riders...locals and those 300,000 or so that Curt has assured us will come IF Peterson builds it.
After 3 years of good bookkeeping we should have a fair idea of how this thing will glide, eh?
Anon...Curm has already said again in this thread that a restaurant with a view of our lovely mountains and the lake should be atop Ben Lomond Hotel. Don't keep saying that no one ever comes up with an idea around here.
All WE say is, don't disparage Mount Ogden Golf Course...most real golfers like to play it. People rave about the natural beauties, and places to go and they have fun here. Just because we say LEAVE OUR OPEN SPACES OPEN, doesn't mean we're against progress.
It means that offering our best does not mean messing it all up with a bunch of cables, towers and cable cars whooosshing over peoples' yards and heads.
Have you been to Antelope Island? Do you think it would be a better attraction if hot dog stands, Hogi Yogi's, Wendy's, Starbuck's and other fast food joints for TOURISTS would make AI a bigger and tourist friendly 'must see'?
I spend money in Ogden, but frankly most of what I want is found in South Ogden, Riverdale, Layton or North Ogden.
Many of the stores I frequent have gone to Layton.
Whose fault is that?
Lime:
The mayor only appoints his lackeys
You know, good LO types, by cracky
He conjures all sorts of schemes
Real bona fide visions and dreams
But,they're all just plain whacky
In Ogden there's now a new dream
To make us all rich (it would seem)
Keep hold of your wallet
For soon we'll all call it
The Peterson Pyramid Scheme!
Anyone looked back at the Gondola-ganda published as
The Hub insert to the Standard Examiner, Aug 31, 2005?
The list of endorsers in the sidebars is telling:
Curt Geiger, Bob Geiger, Chris Peterson, Bernie Allen, Larry Hansen of Pinnacle Marketing, and Dustin Chapman, among others.
The company Dustin is included with is certainly interesting.
I wonder how many of the 'others' stand a chance of being nominated for the Planning Commission vacancies?
The insert was "paid for by People and business for a stronger Ogden". Who might that be?
OG:
Beautiful pictures and glowing words for the most part about Ogden and her beauties NOW.
Were those a lot of different angles of the police bldg?
Thanx for the link. Real pretty pictures. They sell Ogden more than the rhetoric about a gondola!!
Ogdenlover:
I never understood why that "Hub" brochure didn't say it was published by Lift Ogden. There was an article about it in the SE the same day, in which Curt Geiger said that he and others paid for it. An electronic version of it was posted on the LO web site for quite a while, but now I see that the site has been redesigned and it's no longer there.
Some Dude:
STreet seems to be dormant. The latest music listings are May 05 for example. Latest "newsletter" highlights "upcoming" city council meeting to decide funding for high adventure rec center. I checked, before posting what I did about an indy paper for Ogden.
If other names aren't suggested for the Planning Commission, what names do you expect will show up on the nomination sheet?
Don't live up to our reputations and only be against things/people.
Let's be proactive and get good names floating out there.
Ogiii
Thanks very much for the history lesson on alternative free press in Ogden. Much in it I had no idea of. For example, didn't know of the connection between JCN and CW. And I didn't know Ron was the publisher of JCN. Lots more in your post that was new to me. Glad I raised the matter now. Learning a bunch.
And thanks for reminding me of Godfrey pulling city ads from NUJ. The fallout from that was just settling as I arrived and I remember reading in the few issues of NUJ I got to see something about it.
You are absolutely right about CW more or less ignoring Ogden, except very occasionally. Understandable since their main market is SLC. But Ogden sure could use an independent editorial voice to liven things up.
One point [which was raised by "meaner side" not your post]: something about Ron being in the mayor's pocket. What I would like to see in Ogden is an independent editorial voice. That does not mean the paper or editor has always to oppose what city administration does, or everything this mayor does. What it does mean is that the paper and editor have to cast, always, a baleful and suspicious eye on all administrations and actions, and then draw independent conclusions about how they are doing on any given issue. If that approach leads the editors to support administation policy on any given issue, that's fine with me. So long as the editor reaches that conclusion on evidence and independently, and is willing to defend his view in print. And offer space to those who disagree.
An editorial voice that always opposed any given administration [even the present one] would be no more independent, or good for Ogden, than an editorial voice that always supported an administration, regardless of what it did or why.
But the mere fact that an editor of a free press publication agreed with the Mayor, even Mayor Godfrey, on a volitile issues does not, of itself, mean he is "in the mayor's pocket."
Thanks again for filling in the background of Ogden's independent press history. I had no idea it was as rich as, apparently, it is.
you are forgeting another short list newspaper that was around ogden for a while and trying to give ogden a run, was the common cent newspaper. it was run by dan fessler and he also ran for the city council and mayor once. but he could not get it together. but at least he tried.
Rudi
I wonder why you banished the two posts from Philo and Mathew G.
I say you should incourage any one who writes about Henry Africa's, especially those with first hand knowledge.
Like - is the place still in Business?
Is it still "straight", or has it gone "gay"?
You know, stuff we can use.
Just learned that the Trib has weighed in (albeit briefly) with a "thumbs-up" on the Council's corrective action:
http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/ci_4208792
Matt said to the murmuring crowd,
"Our city does not make us proud!
To improve our sad case
We must sell off some space.
And smart growth must not be allowed!"
There once was a dude named Matt
Whose brain fell out in his hat.
He said with a grin
from the emptyness therein
I'll surely make my friends fat.
I Don't know how many saw Hatch tryiong to savew his own hide again, but this letter says it all!
Hatch has it backward
Our esteemed Sen. Orrin Hatch was quoted as saying Middle East terrorists are "waiting for the Democrats here to take control, let things cool off and then strike again."
First of all, this is nothing but an attempt to prey on the fears of the American public. Sen. Hatch is, yet again, attempting to scare us into voting for Republicans.
Second, let's not forget that the worst terrorist strike against America came at a time when Republicans were in control of the White House, the Senate and the House of Representatives. Terrorists knew how easy it would be to get Republicans to wage war and this is the ultimate goal of a terrorist. (What's more frightening
than war?) Democrats, on the other hand, would have waged war only as a last resort.
So to you, Sen. Hatch, let me say that I think you have it quite backward. Terrorists waited until Republicans were in power before striking.
Brad Adkins
Salt Lake City
Thanks brad that is just what I would have said.
Jeff Lowe for PC.
- Born in Ogden
- Internationally known
- Neither SGO nor LO affiliated
- Ogden enthusiast
But I doubt he'd want the job.
Have received utility bill which reflected hike of new water rates resulting in an extra $8 owed. I think this is a pretty sizable increase, myself. Very revenue generating.
anon-
Jeff Lowe may not be the best impartial choice for Planning Commission. He is a little too close to Mr. Petersen for my comfort level.
Knows better,
Don't you think if CP had any influence over JL, JL would show up on the LO supporters list?
Are we to believe that CP would want the names of his secret agent men on the LO list?
Watkins,
You're right. I wasn't thinking. My bad.
It is elementary dear anonymous
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